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Author Topic: African Honeybees  (Read 647 times)

Offline Van, Arkansas, USA

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African Honeybees
« on: February 15, 2017, 11:28:41 AM »
In the American Bee Journal, March 2017 issue there is an excellent photo of the unique wing structure of the African honeybee on page 287.  This is a simple means of distinguishing if a bee is African or not.  The wing of an African honey bee is unique and has 19 landmarks at the vein junction.  That is 19 intersections of the support veins.  I cannot copy and paste the photo, it is copy protected and I don't want issues with our web host or the American Bee Journal.

Just know an African honeybee can be distinguished by unique wing structure and a beautiful picture is in the March issue as previously described.
Blessings

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2017, 12:08:29 PM »
Yall are probably to cold to AHB up there. I am afraid one day we will have them where I live in Alabama

Online Jeff L.

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2017, 02:45:36 PM »
Depends on where he is in Arkansas. They are in quite a few counties in OK.

http://entoplp.okstate.edu/ahb/ahbmap.jpg/image

It is also my understanding the the differences in those measurements are so small they have to be done under a microscope.

Online Jeff L.

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2017, 03:52:21 PM »

Offline Van, Arkansas, USA

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2017, 03:57:49 PM »
I believe you are correct Jeff. A stereo microscope is needed.  However a person that conducts instrumental inseminstion of bees such as myself, will have such a scope.  Much easier to scope a Wing than DNA testing. 

Offline Van, Arkansas, USA

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2017, 04:07:56 PM »
Mr. Jeff.  Thank you for the link.  My gosh, a county that I live in is hot according to the map.  I had no idea......  I thought I was way North of African Bees, I'm only a few miles from Missouri.

I had a cavalier attitude towards swarms.  Not now.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2017, 05:02:47 PM »
How hot are Africanized bees really? Anyone had experiences with them?

Offline Van, Arkansas, USA

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2017, 06:29:58 PM »
I have only read or seen YouTube videos.  I have read one official pathological report that remains clear in my mind.  The deceased individual have over 100 bees in his mouth.  The poor fella had bees in his ears and nose.  I had read unofficial reports they chase a person from 1/4 mile to a mile.  Many livestock have been reported killed by these bees particularly dogs confined to a backyard.

Online texanbelchers

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2017, 10:11:37 PM »
Think Rottweiler.  Sometimes not to bad, but feisty.  Other times they want to bite really hard and won't let go.  They don't like to be pet.  You just never know what they will be like until you are close.

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2017, 10:09:26 AM »
Here are several law cases from the 1850s to the 1920s where bees stung horses or mules to death.  There were no AHB here then...

See Earl v. Van Alstine, 8 Barb. 630 (N.Y. Gen. Term 1850) (horse killed by bees); Johnson v. Tillson, 36 Iowa 89 (1872) (same); Parsons v. Manser, 93 N.W. 86 (Iowa 1903) (same); Petey Mfg. Co. v. Dryden, 62 A. 1056 (Del. 1904) (mules killed); Ammons v. Kellogg, 102 So. 562 (Miss. 1925).

There have always been mean bees and people have always made bad decisions concerning bees and animals.  No animal should be confined where they can't run away from the bees.  Maybe they should train people what to do... Get inside as fast as possible.  Inside a house, inside a car etc.  Drive away from the place, then get out when you are far enough that no bees will come that far from the hive.  Then run some more...

When I have seen bees that would follow really badly, they usually weren't stinging, they were head butting...

Most of the bees in AHB areas are workable.  Some are not.  But then most of the feral bees I've seen in the last 43 years were workable.  Some where not.
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Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2017, 10:27:47 AM »
I know that AHB are the bee that people use in Latin America for the most part so they can be workable. Perhaps they could help tame them down by choosing nicer queens.

Offline sawdstmakr

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2017, 01:43:50 PM »
 
I know that AHB are the bee that people use in Latin America for the most part so they can be workable. Perhaps they could help tame them down by choosing nicer queens.

Wallace that is what is going on is our western states that have been taken over by AHB's. In a Bee college class an instructor came from Brazil and gave a presentation on making propolis in Brazil and he showed a video of them working the hives.
I asked him how they were in the hives and the bees reacted no different than our bees and the big difference was they suited from head to toe.
He said it is all about how you handle them. He said he teaches new students and he will pick the largest hive and take it apart and put it back together.  He then lets the students take the smallest hive apart. Within minutes, even with everyone in full suits, they all had to run to their cars and drive away to get away from the bees.
He mentioned that before they arrive at the apiary, he told the students to close there car windows and leave them unlocked and park them a long way from the hives. He said that every time he did this someone did not follow directions. :cry:
Jim
"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed.  If you do read the newspaper you are misinformed."--Mark Twain

Online Jeff L.

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2017, 01:56:30 PM »
Working Africanized bees in Costa Rica
https://youtu.be/DWqIAqU_U6M

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2017, 05:11:38 PM »
I know that AHB are the bee that people use in Latin America for the most part so they can be workable. Perhaps they could help tame them down by choosing nicer queens.

Wallace that is what is going on is our western states that have been taken over by AHB's. In a Bee college class an instructor came from Brazil and gave a presentation on making propolis in Brazil and he showed a video of them working the hives.
I asked him how they were in the hives and the bees reacted no different than our bees and the big difference was they suited from head to toe.
He said it is all about how you handle them. He said he teaches new students and he will pick the largest hive and take it apart and put it back together.  He then lets the students take the smallest hive apart. Within minutes, even with everyone in full suits, they all had to run to their cars and drive away to get away from the bees.
He mentioned that before they arrive at the apiary, he told the students to close there car windows and leave them unlocked and park them a long way from the hives. He said that every time he did this someone did not follow directions. :cry:
Jim

That is insane. Maybe they can breed that anger out of them.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2017, 05:42:35 PM »
If my bees acted like this I would probably stop bee keeping or really change courses

Offline Van, Arkansas, USA

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2017, 08:28:19 PM »
According to Thomas E. Rinderer, Bee Genetics an Breeding, 1986 pub. The aggressive behavior AHB is due to at least 3 different genes (polygenic) and quantitative.  In plain English that means we don't fully understand the genetics involved as they are very complex, one gene effects another genes expression or lack thereof and individual queens or drones may vary in the magnitude of genes expression.

Backcrosses AHB with gentle Italian, of drone to first generation (F1)daughter by Stort and Rothenbuhler (1960) produced both gentle and aggressive offspring.  Confusing results.  The spread of AHB would indicate to me, dominate genes are a factor.

Online Dallasbeek

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2017, 11:18:48 PM »
Dominant genes are always a factor.  We just need a Brother Adam to sort things out.
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Online Jeff L.

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2017, 09:39:28 AM »
I remember news articles before AHB was in the US, maybe not even to Mexico yet. There were a lot of news source experts that were predicting that by the time they reached the US they would be interbreed with feral bees to the point they would no longer be as defensive.
That didn't work out so well.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2017, 10:38:57 AM »
I would think we would have to do with the AHB just the same we did with the European bees. Pain painstakingly slow selection of gentle traits from our queens to over time create a more docile AHB.

Offline CapnChkn

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Re: African Honeybees
« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2017, 03:15:15 AM »
I can tell you that people are scared of bees in ways that leave me stumped.  I've had association with bees for 40 years now and have seen the same reaction from burly, manly men that run around in sub-zero temperatures with nothing but a whiskered shirt, shiver in terror at my beeyard.  The question I hear the most often is, "Don't they sting you?"

African Hybrids are just bees, and they react differently due to the Hybridization.  After they mix the genes around for a while they mellow out.  It's not in their interest to sting you, they die if they do.  The reaction, in my opinion because I don't have any evidence beyond my observations, seems to be a "Hybrid vigor" and their reaction to pheromones.  Hot AHB simply overreact.  Bees that show neurotic behavior are more likely to die out, and is not in their best interest either.

I lived out in the sticks while in Florida, am in Alabama now, and all my hives are locally caught ferals.  I had little to do with bees in Florida, but never heard or saw any incidents of overly defensive bees.  2 years ago, I had one itchy hive, and they gentled.  After 60 years in the jungle, the bloodthirsty, terrorist bees that originally caused such a sensation in the media seem to be gentling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Africanized_bee#Gentle_Africanized_bees
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