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Author Topic: Wax moths in nuc  (Read 6411 times)

Offline BlueBee

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Wax moths in nuc
« on: August 24, 2011, 12:57:47 am »
Made some walk away splits on Aug 6th with about 2 to 3 frames of brood per split, the other frames were mostly honey and pollen.  We’ve had good weather and lots of drones.  I dug through the first nuc and found the queen and eggs and decided not to bother the other splits for a few more days in case they’re still mating.

The bad news is I found wax moth caterpillars in this first nuc, on the pollen frame.  I squished what I could see, but as you know, once they get a foothold, they‘re hard to get under control in a small colony.  I don’t really want to remove the frame with pollen and freeze it because the queen has layed on the other side and I’m hoping to get in 2 brood cycles before our long winter.

What’s your best advice and tips for controlling wax moths in a small nuc?
« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 01:54:45 am by BlueBee »

Offline Tommyt

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2011, 09:02:09 am »
I THINK yes I wrote caps because its a Big I think as I am still too new at Beeking
  I believe you can keep them down or out with numbers, fill the nuc with bees
maybe swap the location to where you have a strong hive,moths have done a few more in
on my weaker nuc's than I care to say :oops:
good luck


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Offline tefer2

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2011, 09:10:13 am »
I would just add more bee's to them. I made up my 2 story nucs to overwinter on the 15Th of August with mated queens and drawn comb. It will still be an uphill battle to get them strong enough to make it through.

Offline kbee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2011, 10:09:22 am »
 try to cut out the comb where you see the wax mouth eggs clear out webbing reduce the entrance to about an inch then take some pantey hoes and fill them up with ceder chips about a 4 inch ball tac them on the front of the hive near the entrance and the wax mouths don't like the smell of ceder chips it might just help. i know it helped my nucs out.

Offline Larry Bees

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2011, 11:32:17 am »
Do the bees mind the cedar chips?

I have my bees on stands about 15 inches from the ground with screened bottoms and I have a problem with wax moths. If the cedar chips don't bother the bees, maybe I should put a thick layer of cedar chips underneath my hives to control the moths.

Does this sound like it might work?

Anybody try this method of controlling wax moths?

Larry

Offline kbee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2011, 12:28:56 pm »
my bees did not mind the ceder chips. they just went on there normal duties. its just the moths don't like the smell, just like some people put ceder blocks or the whole closet is made out of cedar to keep mouths out. a beehive is the same. try different stuff. see what works best for your bees. i just try different natural ways to keep pest and diseases out and if i see that my bees don't like it( i don't do it). i try to stay away from chemical unless REALLY necessary. 

Offline BeeMaster2

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2011, 12:34:38 pm »
I built my first 2 hives out of cedar. It doesn't bother the bees. I just wish it had some effect on the SHB.
Jim
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Offline Larry Bees

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2011, 02:01:33 pm »
Thanks for your answers!

Jim, did you ever get wax moths in those two cedar hives that you built? I think the solution to the SHB is total all day long sunshine. I had a guy from Jax put bees on my land for several years and he lost several hives from the SHB, but they were in the shade part of the day. Mine are in total sun all day long and I have very few beetles in my hives.

Larry

Offline BlueBee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2011, 02:56:03 pm »
Thanks for the tips, keep them coming!

For my nucs, I usually start off with the entrances reduced to 9mm x 9mm to keep the robbing to a minimum.  However until they become queen right, or have more bees, my nucs don’t seem to do much guarding.   That gives the moths an opportunity to get in after dark.

More bees is a good idea.  The nuc with the moths is weaker than my other splits, probably 2 frames of bees at best.  I may go with more bees after giving the nuc a few more days to mature.  The queen cells just hatched a few days ago. 

Most of my frames are now plastic foundation, so that helps when I have to mechanically control the moths.  Squish, squish, splat!

Aroma at the entrance is an intriguing idea!  I had never heard of, or thought of that, idea before.  Thanks, I like that idea! 

Offline Sundog

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2011, 07:29:52 pm »
I'm not an expert but, I'm pretty certain the cedar boards I made my KTBH from is NOT the same wood as the "cedar closet lining" I used for the hope chest I built for my daughter, or what is in the bottom of the hamster cage at the pet shop.



I cut up the leftovers from the hope chest and hung bundles in the closet for my wife.  The scraps from the hive are still in the garage.

Have fun!

Offline BlueBee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2011, 09:21:45 pm »
Nice looking chest Sundog.  I’m not a wood expert either.  Maybe somebody else will chime in.  It would be nice if the wood shops used botanical names for more of their woods.  It’s seems like there is a half dozen different woods they call cedar!

My guess is the lining of the chest is from the common juniper tree:  Juniperus communis.
My guess is the “cedar” in your top bar hive is from the Western Red Cedar Tree / Western Arborvitae: Thuja plicata.
In the eastern US, the common Arborvitae is often called white ceder:  Thuja Occidentalis.

Don’t really have a guess what the Hamster cedar chips are from.   Anybody know?

Maybe hang a bag of hamster chips on the nuc landing board?

Offline sc-bee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2011, 10:55:22 pm »
Can you get your hands on some bt. There are several different types or strains you will need the type Bt aizawai. It is sold out of the US as Certan. In Canada: http://www.beeworks.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=18

Much cheaper is the brand used to spray fruit and vegetables in the US. Look for the brand Xentari. It has to be Bt aizawai for was moth. It is not sold in the US for bees because the company let the liscense expeire that sold Certan. The Xentari is the same as Certan but in powder from. Check farm co-ops that sell to large farmers.
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Offline Sundog

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2011, 10:58:28 pm »
I think you are about half right, BB.  I think the liner is eastern red cedar.  I think the hamsters use the same wood in shaving form, with less heartwood.

I was counseled not to varnish or urethane the interior of the rest of chest because the cedar  aroma would keep it sticky, so I left the insides natural.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juniperus_virginiana

"The aromatic wood is avoided by moths, so it is in demand as lining for clothes chests and closets, often referred to as cedar closets and cedar chests. If correctly prepared, it makes excellent English longbows, flatbows, and Native American sinew-backed bows. The wood is marketed as "eastern red cedar" or "aromatic cedar".

Have fun!

Offline BlueBee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2011, 11:04:50 pm »
Sundog, if I’m only half right, I’m probably doing better than normal.  Thanks for the link!

Sc bee, yes I have some BT aizawai (Xentari brand) that I tried on some coddling moths.  Any tips on how to effectively use it against wax moths in a hive?

Offline sc-bee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2011, 11:15:47 pm »
Very effective--- 3-4 tsp per gallon will do at least 90 frames or more to protect frames when storing. A product that most don't use and should when stroing frames. A 1lb bag goes a long way.
You can spray it directly on the bees it will not hurt. Not sure if the temp change of the water, Might kill the brood? Maybe use warm tap water and spray a mist lightly on brood areas?
And double check it has to be Bt aizawai.
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Offline sc-bee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2011, 11:17:15 pm »
Sorry you did say Xentari :oops:
Find a label for Certan--- you will see it is the same!
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Offline TwoHoneys

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2011, 07:54:38 am »
I keep reading that I should freeze comb to eliminate wax moths. But does that mean I freeze the comb only for a certain period of time and then remove it from the freezer? Or does it mean I have to keep the frames in the freezer until I reuse the comb?

I have a deep freezer, but it's not large enough to keep all those frames all winter long.

This week, I reduced the size of most of my hives, and I don't want to put those empty combs back on the weaker colonies to keep the moths in check...those hives already have their work cut out for them without the burden of keeping moths at bay.

-Liz
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Offline sc-bee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2011, 09:15:19 am »
You freeze about 48 hrs to kill eggs if you have wax moths. When you take the frames from the freezer, if the weather is still warm, wax moths will get in them again if you do not store them properly.
That is why I have found Bt to be easier.
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Offline kbee

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Re: Wax moths in nuc
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2011, 10:52:56 am »
bluebee yes hamster chips, bedding it will say cedar chips on front  got them at tractor suppley