Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum

BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => GENERAL BEEKEEPING - MAIN POSTING FORUM. => Topic started by: tjc1 on July 04, 2013, 12:42:37 am

Title: Open feeding method
Post by: tjc1 on July 04, 2013, 12:42:37 am
Experimenting with a way to open feed without drowning bees and came up with this. Plastic mesh window screen cut to fit the dish - it then floats on the syrup as it is consumed. If you sit the dish in a larger dish or pan of water, you can keep the ants out... :roll:


(http://s23.postimg.org/5pdsx3fef/IMG_4619.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/5pdsx3fef/)

(http://s23.postimg.org/l9gl9w053/IMG_4621.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/l9gl9w053/)

(http://s23.postimg.org/phbdin1kn/Sipping_bee.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/phbdin1kn/)
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: capt44 on July 04, 2013, 12:53:51 am
I use a concrete bird bath with SB2 gravel in the bottom and sticks broken up and placed in the feeder.
I call the sticks Bee Boats.
Hey it works.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 04, 2013, 02:20:32 am
Nicely done again. X:X

I like your idea so well I might just steal it this fall. :-D

I have tried foam and wood floats in the past but they all had problems.  This looks like a better idea.  My only concern is the size of the plate.  Need to scale that up somehow when you've got more hives looking to feed.  

We are having a glorious summer in Michigan this year.  Lots of rain and normal temps for a change. X:X  Tons of white clover for the bees to harvest along with the lindens that are blooming.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: JPinMO on July 04, 2013, 02:59:49 am
Very interesting. For watering, hubby wire-tied mesh screen to a circle of tubing so it floats inside 5-gallon bucket. (He first tried a piece of old garden hose, but smaller tubing worked better). We're not getting much rain right now; thank Heaven we're not in the heat wave and drought we had last year. 

We have hive-top feeders; I never considered open feeding like this. Tjc, do you have more than one hive?
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 04, 2013, 05:05:27 am
.
Open feeding is from ...I cannot say it for banning.

I cannot understand what idea is in that. It makes only a riot to bee yard and bees kill each other.
Perhaps you loose couple of week nucs.

Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 04, 2013, 11:53:58 am
No riots here Finski. 8-)

Our friend TBeek from Wisconsin convinced me to try open feeding last year and it worked fine.  I think of it as an easy way to top off the winter stores in the fall.  Yes, it can get the bees in a robbing mode, but I didn’t have any hives robbed out when I did it.  Putting syrup inside my hives was just as likely, if not more so, to promote robbing for me.  The bees can really smell where you put the syrup in the fall.

I miss TBeek, I hope he comes back for the Winter debate.   X:X
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 04, 2013, 12:06:29 pm
Putting syrup inside my hives was just as likely, if not more so, to promote robbing for me.

And I have wasted my 51 years for nothing in beekeeping.

Syrup does not promote  robbing.  Oh dear.

Force may be with your honey balls!  (not horse)
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 04, 2013, 12:20:39 pm
There is still hope we may teach you something after 51 years Finski. ;)

You can’t seriously tell me you’ve never opened a nuc with a top feeder and found it completely packed with bees; far more bees than what were in the nuc prior to adding the feeder.  Adding syrup is like ringing the dinner bell.

The beauty of honey balls is they don’t set off a feeding frenzy inside a hive like syrup does.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Kathyp on July 04, 2013, 12:21:08 pm
open feeding works well in spring.  it's handy to mix only a couple of gallons and put it out.  

open feeding in later summer or fall will bring yellowjackets and all their nasty cousins.  save the open feeding for spring.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 04, 2013, 12:27:22 pm
We usually have a killing frost here by Oct 15th and that takes out most of the yellow jackets.  I hold off on open feeding until mid to late October.  There are asters and goldenrod for the bees to work up until about Oct 15th.

In a milder climate, open feeding in the fall might be a real mess as Kathy says.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: tjc1 on July 04, 2013, 07:13:24 pm
To JPin MO - I have only one hive and a nuc with a newly caught swarm. I was experimenting with open feeding just now because I wanted to give something to the swarm nuc but A) didn't want them to get robbed as a result and 2) couldn't quite figure out how to feed a nuc and have it enclosed, which some folks suggest might incite robbing. The alternative that I read somewhere here was to open feed.

I would imagine that you could adapt this to a larger area container/tray - the plastic mesh floats, tho I don't know what quantity of bees it could support before it started to get pushed under... I can see how the JPinMO's screen float in the bucket might work for larger operations.

Interestingly, watching the feeder today it seemed as if I am primarily feeding someone else's bees; most of those leaving the feeder tanked up headed off across the brook rather than back to the nuc... :roll: With the linden in bloom, I think that I'll take the feeder in and assume they can take care of themselves - one reason I was feeding is that I have given them three out of five foundationless frames and I thought they'd need the extra food to make all that wax.

Finski, I can imagine how open feeding in a large beeyard might cause a riot.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: derekm on July 04, 2013, 07:42:58 pm
.
Open feeding is from ...I cannot say it for banning.

I cannot understand what idea is in that. It makes only a riot to bee yard and bees kill each other.
Perhaps you loose couple of week nucs.


you get fighting around water as well... We have a pond and although there is plenty of room for all skirmishes occur
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 04, 2013, 07:52:26 pm


You can’t seriously tell me you’ve never opened a nuc with a top feeder and found it completely packed with bees; far more bees than what were in the nuc prior to adding the feeder.  Adding syrup is like ringing the dinner bell.


hehe hehe heh . Feeding hives so full that queen cannot lay.

I just carried hives to Canola. 5 weeks ago they had 3 frames and now they have 2 brood + 4 medium supers.
No feeding. They have lived with holy spirit.

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 04, 2013, 07:57:38 pm


Finski, I can imagine how open feeding in a large beeyard might cause a riot.

I have 30 hives and then I put on the yard 600 litres winter syrup. - What a wonder full world!
Or is it better to say world full of wonder .

I fed my one box hives full in 2 days.
2 box hives I feed in one week.

Why I should change the system and feed them from September to National Day 6.12.

.National day honey balls?

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 04, 2013, 08:20:59 pm
We usually have a killing frost here by Oct 15th and that takes out most of the yellow jackets.  I hold off on open feeding until mid to late October.  There are asters and goldenrod for the bees to work up until about Oct 15th.

In a milder climate, open feeding in the fall might be a real mess as Kathy says.


when we have killing frost here about 15.9, hives must be feeded and food capped.
Quite idiotic to wake up bees that they start brooding again.

.in Spring feeding with syrup has no value. My hives have so much winter food left that I must get them consumed by bees. I give pollen patty and it has sugar 50%. And I even food frames that sugar vanishes before summer yield.

Why open feeding, I just wonder why?
Not a slightest reason.  or if you want more honey...
.



.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: sc-bee on July 04, 2013, 09:00:17 pm

I just carried hives to Canola. 5 weeks ago they had 3 frames and now they have 2 brood + 4 medium supers.
No feeding. They have lived with holy spirit.

I am glad I read that over again. I thought he said he moved hives to Canada. I was trying to figure out how he did that from Findland. But Finski is da man  :-D
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 01:33:00 am


I am glad I read that over again. I thought he said he moved hives to Canada. I was trying to figure out how he did that from Findland. But Finski is da man  :-D

Good heavens what I have went went to do!. Mercy sky!

You surely need somethong better in your life than open feeding.

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 05, 2013, 01:41:42 am
Well, it’s like this Finski.  I live in a continental climate which means we can get some wild temperature swings in November and even December.  It’s a battle between the cold arctic air pushing down from Canada and the warm moist air from the Gulf of Mexico.  When the gulf wins, the bees wake up rather you want them too or not!  When they’re awake they fly and consume energy, lots of energy (honey/sugar).

If we have an extended warm spell, all that flying can take a toll on the food they’re suppose to have to get through winter.  So I have a few options, I could break the boxes back open and add the feeders again but in November and December it’s going to be too cold at night for the syrup to be usable, so the feeders really can’t solve this problem.  Then if you don’t get the feeders off before an arctic blast comes, you have a real mess.

Another option is throwing some honey balls on top of the bees.  That does work well, even when there isn’t a festival to celebrate. X:X  The honey balls don’t draw the robbers like syrup will.  However it still requires you to open the hives and I seem to recall somebody in Finland saying that wasn’t a good idea in winter. :brian:

So finally there is open feeding.  When the bees are flying in Nov or December at least a little open feed allows them to top off the stores so they’ll be re-filled before the cold sets in for good.  Fast and easy with minimum intrusion to the bees.  :)
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 02:42:22 am
.

November and December it’s going to be too cold at night for the syrup to be usable, so the feeders really can’t solve this problem.  Then if you don’t get the feeders off before an arctic blast comes, you have a real mess.

Another option is throwing some honey balls on top of the bees.


I feed hives at the beginning of september that hives have enough food to May.

How about in nature the hives. Do they get something out of booming season?

.You will never learn. But do as you like. No one can help you.
.

I have said several times that this forum is more dangerous to hives than winter.

.



.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Steel Tiger on July 05, 2013, 03:00:14 am
 I've read and heard the pros and cons about open feeding. Although it's really neat to watch, it's not something I'll be planning on doing unless I somehow end up with several dozen hives that need feeding... all at the same time.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Mircea_63 on July 05, 2013, 03:54:45 am
I don`t know if I understand all what is wrote, but I am astonished. First I purpose this is a humor topic. :-\

 I am only in second year of beekeeping, but in beekeeping should bee something like Decalogue (the  10 commandments) and one of then is no open feeding.

 Open feeding means to feed in outside of the hives? If reply is "no", I am in a great error.  :?

 Wintering is more simple, and Manny beek love to complicated this.
 Strong family
 Various treatment
 Enough Honey in the caped combs.
 Peace and quiet
 Dry...
 Honey balls only in emergency...rescue. 

  In my country we have Siberian winter...
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 05:07:35 am

  In my country we have Siberian winter...


Political?

Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 08:10:27 am
No riots here Finski. 8-)



what else you have there.

What I have learned on this forum is

- do nothing
- don't extract honey (poor man's job)
- feed all year around. Buy honey from market and make honey balls
- peace for varroa!
- use natural combs and burn recycled wax
- encourage comb building feeding sugar the whole summer.
- be positive and be allways same opinion with stupid questions.

- me America, me no mites

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Mircea_63 on July 05, 2013, 12:52:22 pm

  In my country we have Siberian winter...


Political?



 :lau: Is not so cold like in your country, of course.

 Last winter, minimum degree was -31 Celsius
 Last Summer, maximum degree was +43,5 Celsius

  Political? Of course, our politicians are bleep. Yours are  Virgin Mary?
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Kathyp on July 05, 2013, 02:49:52 pm
you boys are funny  :-D

open feeding can have some advantages in spring, especially for the small beekeeper.  if you have a place you might not get to for a few days, a couple of gallons of syrup in a chicken waterer will make sure that one hive does not run out of syrup.  for me, i have a hike to my hives so it's much easier to carry a couple of gallons in one bucket.

it's just another thing that MIGHT work for some people.  it's just not a good thing after the spring because then it will draw other critters!
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 03:14:27 pm
you boys are funny  :-D

open feeding can have some advantages in spring, especially for the small beekeeper.

Yes, it gives bigger spring yeidl, but it is 250% sure that it gives no advantage to spring build up.

It is better to study from US reseaches. When bees get pollen, it accelerates brooding. Not sugarwater.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 03:17:19 pm

 Last winter, minimum degree was -31 Celsius
 Last Summer, maximum degree was +43,5 Celsius

  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Romania (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Romania)

Seems bad place

Our coldest measure is -50C.  Warmest +33C
http://ilmatieteenlaitos.fi/lampimin-ja-kylmin-paikka-vuosittain (http://ilmatieteenlaitos.fi/lampimin-ja-kylmin-paikka-vuosittain)

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Mircea_63 on July 05, 2013, 05:36:55 pm
  
[/quote]

Our coldest measure is -50C..
[/quote]

 :chop: Respect!!!


 Finski, I have saw a big difference about American beekeepers opinion and beekeepers from my country. Romanian beekeeping school and books have an opinion exactly like yours.
 In springtime, if no pollen, no brooding and they don`t get sugarwater. May be feed with honney-pollen cake. 

 But small portion of syrup can get impression of harvest for bees and the bees determinate the queen to laying. If this happend and bees have not enough pollen, result an  imbalance. The bees consume the vitelogenin reserves and their life shortens.
 The brood is not strong and health enough without pollen.

 Who knows, made.Who does not know, teach others. I am newbee. :roll:



Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 05, 2013, 06:08:03 pm
 

Our coldest measure is -50C..
[/quote]

 :chop: Respect!!!


 Who knows, made.Who does not know, teach others. I am newbee. :roll:


[/quote]

There is a difference with funkeepers and beekeepers.

.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: edward on July 05, 2013, 07:44:42 pm
One of the interesting Thinks Reading the site is different ways to keep bees around the world and in different climates.
Things that are right for some may not bee right for others.

Here in Sweden we are not aloud to open air feed  :police: This is part of trying to minimize contamination beetween hives and beeyards.

mvh Edward  :-P
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: tjc1 on July 06, 2013, 12:11:46 am
.

I feed hives at the beginning of september that hives have enough food to May.

How about in nature the hives. Do they get something out of booming season?

.You will never learn. But do as you like. No one can help you.
.

I have said several times that this forum is more dangerous to hives than winter.
.

Finski, for all the frustration that we give you, I am truly glad that you stick around because you have a lot of wisdom to share that's worth hearing - and we DO listen, really! I've learned a lot from you and changed a number of my new-beekeeper-dangerous-ways ;) Thanks for your input - and I have put my open feeding experiment away...
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: BlueBee on July 06, 2013, 02:10:34 am
You will never learn. But do as you like. No one can help you.
I wish somebody could help me. :?  I have a big problem; my bees are bursting at the seams.  Maybe it’s those honey balls on the holidays, or that November open feeding, or my electric heat, or my poly hives, or jumbo frames, or mid entrances, I don’t know what, but the bees do fantastic despite the ridicule. :laugh:

I do agree with Finski that open feeding just doesn’t make sense in the spring and summer.  We only differ in the fall and winter.  :-D
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 06, 2013, 02:54:15 am

I wish somebody could help me. :?  I have a big problem; my bees are bursting at the seams. 

It is July now, and a seems are bursting?

Quite late time to burst. I have allready 6 boxes in hives.
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Mircea_63 on July 06, 2013, 03:45:32 am
Maybe it’s those honey balls on the holidays, or that November open feeding, or my electric heat, or my poly hives, or jumbo frames, or mid entrances, I don’t know what, but the bees do fantastic despite the ridicule. :laugh:


 And air conditioner? :shock: You will have trouble with bees protection institute. :'(
Title: Re: Open feeding method
Post by: Finski on July 06, 2013, 03:52:05 am
  We only differ in the fall and winter.  :-D


Yes. You are only one who I know who feed bees in the middle on winter in -14C temp (honey balls)

How we differ in fall?  Yes, it is still Atlantic Ocean between us.