double walls

[Paraplegic Racehorse]

[also posted at BeeSource forums]

Does anyone, particularly in areas of cold windy winters, have actual experience using double-wall hives? Do the bees in these hives seem to winter better, worse or about the same as single-wall homes? Has anyone thought to experiment with this? If so, are there construction plans available?

The only reverences to double-wall hives I've been able to find are those for the English WBC and Irish CDB hive and both at Dave Cushman's site. I wonder what advantages they may offer in terms of wind/rain/cold resistance over their single-wall sisters.

[Finsky]

That construction is very usual in our country. In old days they used wood panel in both walls but that construction is awfully heavy.

Nowadays you may use water resistant 4 mm ply wood  you may put polyuretane foam inside. But I think that construction is expencive and slow to make.  That kind of hive acts like styrofoam hive. IWalls do not breath.

Stryfoam hives are very popular here. They are warm and light to handle. Splended to handle. I have had them 19 years and all boxes are still in use.

[Paraplegic Racehorse]

That construction is very usual in our country.

Thanks for replying, Finsky. I have been closely watching your posts over the last several weeks, largely due to the similarities of our climactic conditions. I have considered foam hives, but eventually rejected them due to cost. For me, spruce is very very inexpensive and has similar characteristics to cedar.

I am considering building an outer shell (1/2-inch thick), similar to the WBC lifts, specifically for wintering sheltering. That is, when spring warms enough, the hives will be removed from the shells so I do not have to do more lift-n-carry than necessary. I have been thinking such a shelter might provide several benefits: (a) insulation value of dead-air space, (b) protection from wind, (c) a place for water vapor to escape without exposing the hive vents to wind/cold. What are your thoughts on these? What disadvantages, other than weight, am I missing?

[Finsky]

[. I have considered foam hives, but eventually rejected them due to cost.

Their price was high when I started to bye them, but with first experimental boxes I found that spring development was so much faster that boxes paid themselves back in first summer with bigger yields.

If you have styrofoam box per hive, the rest may be solid wook like I have.  Those two boxes are ment for winter and spring. [/quote]

I am considering building an outer shell (1/2-inch thick), similar to the WBC lifts, specifically for wintering sheltering.

I don't quite undestand ? For each hive or big shelter for many?

 (a) insulation value of dead-air space, Insulation is better if there is gap which does not concuct heat outside. In practice wood wall is very wet during winter because vapour condensates into the wood.

(b) protection from wind, ... wind ptotection is allways needed

(c) a place for water vapor to escape without exposing the hive vents to wind/cold.  That water vapour talking is too much valuated. People generates vain systems around simple matter. You need only tiny upper entrance in the wall and there it is.

The one, which beekeepers do not talk at all is the warm brood boxes during spring build up.  It is huge question for early yields. Since I started to heat hives with electrict in spring, I found that it is more imporant than I ever quessed.

Our yield season is 2 months June and July. If hives go natural way they are able to catch yield only in July. With early development June will be yield season too from dandelion blooming to canola and raspberry.

I have feeded hives with pollen 15 years. For 4 years I have heated them with electrict. Together this system spring build up is 3 times faster than in natural way. During cold springs this is good system.

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After all my opinion is that good pastures give the big yield. Every year I may find that some place gives 3-fold yield than another. This is the secret of transfer hives. Now I keep only 1-3 hive per site.

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One solution is not good enough to make better result. It is the whole years cycle ho to have big hive to forage and what forage.

And there are huge number of actions which do not bring more honey to hoves. It is just beepeers playing. 90% of these discussions do not bring more honey into hives. Just fun.   .... What car you have? .... and all cars make the same transport funtion.




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[Finsky]

Seward's climate  is much like Anchorage ?  Our average temp is abou 3 C higher than yours.

[Michael Bush]

I put my hives up against each other.  That's a double wall between each hive isn't it?

:)

[Finsky]

  That's a double wall between each hive isn't it?
:)

Is it half double?, because half of walls are double. Or half single because half of walls are sigle?  Semisinglehiverow.

How goes the math in this case?

[Michael Bush]

>How goes the math in this case?

Or is it MORE than double for the two long walls since there are, between the hive and the outside, many hives each with two walls...

:)

[Paraplegic Racehorse]

Seward's climate  is much like Anchorage ?

No, Seward is warmer than Anchorage. Our winter temps are usually +/- 10F of freezing, but we get much more precipitation.

http://www.wrcc.dri.edu/cgi-bin/cliMAIN.pl?aksewa

[Kirk-o]

Yes I think the foam ones would be good especially in Alaska
kirk-o