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Author Topic: Need References  (Read 2291 times)

Offline Understudy

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Need References
« on: February 05, 2007, 07:58:12 pm »
I need some notable references to confirm the following:
How far do bees fly to gather pollen and nectar?
How many eggs does a queen lay a day?
What is the internal temprature of a beehive?
How much honey does a worker bee make in it's lifetime?
How many bees in a colony?
How long have humans been beekeeping?

Now here is the catch. You can't give the answers without citing the source. The source may not be wikipedia or the international bee research association. You source must be of good caliber. You cannot use a local beekeeper site, or a retailer.
Now if a retailer or a local group cites good sources use those. Also if you have contact information on the sources please post it.

Now not to make you think I am asking you guys to do my homework. Here is what is going on. I am doing a FAQ for the local beekeeper club. What I have found in doing google searches and from my libraray is that answers vary. I have several very good sources with things like PhD and other letters on the end of their names. The problem is they don't agree and the answers have changed over the years. If you are reading a book from the 1950s you are going to find it very different from one written in the 1990s.

What I am going to do is see if you guys find similar sources to my information or different resources than I intend to cite. I want to have at least two good sources for what I put up on the FAQ for my local beekeepers. I suspect that this  will be a little bit harder than a normal question but I want to do it right.  If you can find reports and similar and provide links please do. 

I am not looking to critize or disrupt the balance but an example is: how far do bees travel for food ranges from 2 miles to four miles. I know I could split the difference or say 2-4 miles but I really don't want to do that.

I hope I don't hurt anyone's brain and thanks in advance for the help.

Sincerely,
Brendhan
The status is not quo. The world is a mess and I just need to rule it. Dr. Horrible

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Need References
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2007, 08:11:12 pm »
>How far do bees fly to gather pollen and nectar?

"Different authors maintain, they can fly several leagues from the hive. But by the few observations I have been able to make, this distance seems greatly exaggerated. It appears to me that the radius of the circle they traverse does not exceed half a league (½ league=1 ½ miles=2 ½ km). As they return to the hive with the greatest precipitation whenever a cloud passes before the sun, it is probable they do not fly far. Nature which has inspired them with such terror for a storm, and even for rain, undoubtedly restrains them from going so far as to be too much exposed to the injuries of the weather. I have endeavored to ascertain the fact more positively, by transporting to various distances bees with the thorax painted, that they might again be recognized. But none ever returned that I had carried for twenty-five or thirty minutes from their dwelling, while those at a shorter distance have found their way and returned. I do not state this experiment as decisive. Though bees do not generally fly above half a league, it is very possible they go much farther when flowers are scarce in their own vicinity. A conclusive experiment must be made in vast arid or sandy plains, separated by a known distance from a fertile region."  François Huber, 1 October 1791, NEW OBSERVATIONS ON THE NATURAL HISTORY OF BEES

"The bees at our home apiary averaged close to 1 cwt. per colony, including winter stores, from the heather.  The nearest heather was some 2 3/4 miles away and at a height of about 1,200 ft,. it must be assumed the bees had to fly a further mile or two into the moor, or a total distance of no less than 3 1/2 miles." Brother Adam, In Search of the Best Strains of Bees

>What is the internal temprature of a beehive?

"Now that I am on the subject of thermometrical observations, I may curiously remark, that M. Dubois of Bourg en Bresse, in a memoir otherwise valuable, is of opinion, that the larvae cannot be hatched below 104°. I have repeatedly made the experiment with the most accurate thermometers and obtained a very different result. When the thermometer rises to 104°, the heat is so much greater than the eggs require, that it is intolerable to the bees. M. Dubois has been deceived, I imagine, by too suddenly introducing his thermometer into a cluster of bees and putting them in agitation, the mercury has risen higher than it should naturally do. Had he delayed introducing the thermometer, he would soon have seen it fall to between 95° and 97°, which is the usual temperature of hives in summer. In August this year, when the thermometer in the open air stood at 94°, it did not rise above 99° in the most populous hives. The bees had little motion and a great many rested on the board of the hive.) "  François Huber, 1 October 1791, NEW OBSERVATIONS ON THE NATURAL HISTORY OF BEES
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Offline Jerrymac

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Re: Need References
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2007, 09:16:19 pm »
http://www.lasi.group.shef.ac.uk/pdf/rbeeimpr2000.pdf

"The greatest estimate came from Eckert who studied bees in the desert in the western
United States and reported that they flew up to 13.5km to the nearest irrigated area which was where flowers were located."
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Offline Understudy

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Re: Need References
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2007, 10:03:51 pm »
This is a great example of what I mean. Michael cites an excellent source from 1791.   Jerrymac cites a very different distance from a source that dates from 2000. Here is the issue I don't want to blow either off. What I will know need is another source. Jerrymac your article shows several sources at the end of it. I am looking up those right now.

I believe these simple questions could drive  a researcher or a beekeeper mad.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

PS. Michael did you know you are cited as a refernce to wikipedia's article on Beekeeping.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beekeeping
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Offline Jerrymac

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Re: Need References
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2007, 02:16:42 am »
:rainbowflower:  Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.   :rainbowflower:

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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Need References
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2007, 07:41:33 am »
The real answer is that bees SELDOM fly beyond 1 1/2 miles because it is a point of diminishing returns.  As Huber pointed out: "A conclusive experiment must be made in vast arid or sandy plains, separated by a known distance from a fertile region."  When someone in a desert tried to prove it they came up with a much larger number.  The maximum distance bees occasionally fly out of necessity is a very hard number to pinpoint.  Huber's experiment is valid in that he is proving that at 1 1/2 miles the bees know the way home and at 2 miles they don't.  But, as he points out, he's not in the desert. :)

>PS. Michael did you know you are cited as a refernce to wikipedia's article on Beekeeping.

Looks like just a link, not a citation.  Here's a citation attributed to me:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Checkerboarding_%28beekeeping%29

I don't know who posted the Checkerboarding one.
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Offline Jerrymac

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Re: Need References
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2007, 12:00:29 pm »
But the question is how far will bee fly to gather nectar pollen, not how for can they fly to make it back with nectar.
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Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Need References
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2007, 08:59:45 pm »
I think the difference is how far CAN they and how far DO they usually.
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Offline BEE C

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Re: Need References
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2007, 06:55:01 am »
Sorry to tack this on here, but it applies somewhat I believe...How many hives can you fit into a given area?  This seems to be one of THOSE questions that drives beekeeping students nuts.  I have never been given the same answer twice, or without a disclaimer to the answer tacked on.  Ok, I guess that was a complaint not a question.... :-D