Tips for working very strong hive

[Koala John]

Haha - how did you guess? LOVE those gum leaves! 
:-D  :-D

[Koala John]

An update - I went through some strong hives over the weekend and put into practise some of your suggestions. I had significantly better results this time, and found it almost stress free thanks to some of thse tips. The tip about rotating hive bodies saved a lot of bees lives and hence kept the hive calm. I found that in all my hives I had evenly spaced the frames which made lifting frames very hard. So every chance i get I am fixing that and pressing them together to leave space at either end to allow easier frame removal. I think that will make a really big difference.

Lastly, something simple I had missed - when I was scraping burr comb or trying to put a cover back on that had huge amounts of bees clustered in the way, I used to just blunder through, usually upsetting/killing a lot of bees. On the weekend I consciously used a lot of smoke until they all got out of the way. Once again, no squashed bees. In some instances this took a heap of smoke (note that I wasn't blowing it into the hive, just across the top to move the bees out of the way). I found that I need to have the smoker well alight blowing cool smoke, one only blowing a fraction of the usual amount would not do the trick.

So thanks again to all those that gave advise, I feel like I'm on the road to some big improvements now and am not dreading my next foray into a booming hive.

[Michael Bush]

>So every chance i get I am fixing that and pressing them together to leave space at either end to allow easier frame removal. I think that will make a really big difference.

If you start out that way it's best.  Trying to convert is more difficult as they are often too fat to fit well.  Be careful you don't have comb against comb this way.

>Lastly, something simple I had missed - when I was scraping burr comb

There's one of your problems.  :)  Try leaving it.

>or trying to put a cover back on that had huge amounts of bees clustered in the way, I used to just blunder through, usually upsetting/killing a lot of bees. On the weekend I consciously used a lot of smoke until they all got out of the way. Once again, no squashed bees. In some instances this took a heap of smoke (note that I wasn't blowing it into the hive, just across the top to move the bees out of the way).

Sometimes a brush is more useful.  But be sure to flick them out of the way and do NOT gently brush them ever.

[jojoroxx]

I appreciate this thread. I also have taken to the combined smoke and sugar syrup spray for controlling the bees while inspecting them. The sugar syrup (1to1) seems to divert their attention (they immediately start grooming one another) and it impedes their flight somewhat. The only drawback to using the sugar spray is that it attracts ants like mad, so after inspection I go out and scrub down the outside of the hives  and the pallets that  the hives are on with a mild soapy water or the ants will come in a hurry to "assist" in the clean up. :shock:

[bugleman]

I didn't see this mentioned above but be sure to work the bottom box first.  That way you are working unalarmed bees as you go.

[Bennettoid]

To complicate things, this one is sitting on a small platform 15 feet high that I climb up to via a ladder. It certainly concentrates the mind up there ;-)

 :shock:

[heaflaw]

This is a great post.  But please comment on my technique:

1. All my supers that I don't use for honey that I rob have frame spacers (9).  That is how I started as a beginner & I haven't changed them.  So, I have to lift the frames out vertically and cannot slide them over until I get at least 2 frames out.  I don't seem to kill or upset the bees.

2. I use another deep on an upturned outer cover to put the first 2 or 3 frames in.  It seems to keep them happier for them to be somewhat enclosed instead of out in the open leaning on the super or on a frame hanger.

3. My theory is that blowing smoke into the hive before I enter disrupts their routine for the day and I lose honey.

4. Why work the bottom super first?

5. The way I put the top super on is hold it in place above the bottom one, slide one end into place & then lower & raise the super several times until the bees are out of the way before I let it rest.

6.  I always start at one end.  Fewer bees to possibly kill and the queen will seldom be on the end frames.

7. I use a frame gripper to lift out each frame.  That way I have another hand free for smoke or scraping or whatever & it's easy to turn it around to see each side.   I seldom use smoke for any reason except to move them so I can get the frame gripper on the frame.

Thanks

[bugleman]

Why work the bottom supers first?

Believe me I have done it the other way, mostly due to exuberance, and it doesn't work.  If you smoke, wait and then lift the top cover, smoke and start pulling frames, as the bees become agitated you smoke them down again.  (I had a very grumpy hive, black feral, and I had to smoke them every 20 seconds or they would start buzzing, head butting me like crazy and stinging my hands etc., you know the mean warning buzz sound).  Anyway, if you keep smoking the mad bees down they start sending alarm pheromone or?  Now you are done with this top box.  The first box usually doesn't go too bad.  So, you set the first box to the side and now there is a million bees in the second box which were drove down from the top box due to all the smokeing on top of the frames(from the top box).   Who knows, maybe you pull the frame the queen is on you can tell because they get even more agitated.  The whole cycle really starts snow balling and not only are you driving pee'd bees down but they really start to well up, poring out, from even deeper and things are not fun at all then.

You then Get the Hell out of there! 

If you start at the bottom you are not working your way down and meeting the bees you are forcing down.