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Author Topic: Kids and guns  (Read 2015 times)

Offline OldMech

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Kids and guns
« on: March 26, 2015, 10:39:54 AM »


   When my kids were 4.. they went to a daycare. My wife dropped them off in the morning, I picked them up in the afternoon..  The ladies husband that ran the daycare learned I was a gunsmith, and HAD to show me his original rolling block.. he opened the case in their kitchen..  within moments there were a dozen little kids all gathered around yelling to touch it and asking questions..
   Astounded, i looked for my own boy and girl (twins)  I looked up at the lady running the daycare and asked where my two were.. 
   she smiled and shook her head, talking loudly to be heard, she said..  they ran in with the rest to see what was going on.. your daughter turned to your son and said..  "Oh, its just a gun." then they went back to watching cartoons.

   Some people say, that if they were allowed to spank their kids, maybe they would have some respect...
   I agree, and, I disagree.  At certain times of my young life, I got the belt or a switch two or three times a week, and,,  to be honest, I deserved it! SO some kids need it more than others.
   I used the belt on my kids a total of two times. The first time, they set the house on fire, the second time, they decided to drive to town (4 miles) on our 4 wheelers, down the highway, at the ripe old age of 12..   My daughter said she was going to call the police. My wife handed her the phone, and said. You might want to make some calls and find a place to live first, because if you call the police you wont be living here any more.

   Both of my children were around guns from the day they were born, so it was always important that they respect those guns.
   Then my son went to Afghanistan.. and got into trouble..   When he came home, in the airport, he hugged me, and fell to his knees. He put the medal and plaque in my hands, and told me, without the things I had taught him, he would never have earned them, and a lot of people would have been hurt or worse.
He said,
    "YOU earned those awards dad, not me."
   I still dont know what happened, and he wont talk about it. What matters, is that he was capable, and that He, AND his team came home.

  In nearly 51 years of being around guns, working on them, shooting them, handling them, and watching other people handle them, I have never, had a single gun hop out of its case, or off the rack holding it, and try to hurt me.
39 Hives and growing.  Havent found the end of the comfort zone yet.

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2015, 12:08:27 PM »
Kids who have had their curiosity satisfied and who have seen and heard the results of a gun firing are very unlikely to get into the guns unsupervised.  The secret is to satisfy that curiosity while they ARE supervised.  Even better if they see an animal dispatched.  Observing death is a very sobering experience even when it is a sheep or a pig.  And it leave no doubt about what a gun will do.
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2015, 12:34:14 PM »
"  In nearly 51 years of being around guns, working on them, shooting them, handling them, and watching other people handle them, I have never, had a single gun hop out of its case, or off the rack holding it, and try to hurt me."

OldMech, I've been around guns about 70 years and I've never seen a gun jump up and try to hurt ANYBODY.  You can take all the guns away and you'll still have a criminal problem, but if you take all the criminals away, you won't have a gun problem. (paraphrasing Jeff Cooper)
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2015, 02:57:36 PM »
>(paraphrasing Jeff Cooper)

Actually I think you got the quote perfectly correct.
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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2015, 03:17:17 PM »
I was too lazy to go look it up.   :grin:
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline OldMech

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2015, 12:46:30 AM »
 You can take all the guns away and you'll still have a criminal problem, but if you take all the criminals away, you won't have a gun problem.

   Well said, or quoted!  :grin:
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Offline jvalentour

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2015, 01:37:24 AM »
Old,
I own a preschool.  I wish I could teach the same lesson your kids (and mine) know to others.  Your story is touching to say the least.
In a happier vein, I do take packages of bees in for the kids to see.  They love what they see and seem to be fearless.  Hopefully their exposure to bees will encourage them to get away from the TV and back into the real world.
J

PS, Thank your son for his service to our country. 

Offline OldMech

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2015, 10:48:06 AM »
PS, Thank your son for his service to our country. 

   I do, all the time..  I served, and most of my family did as well. On my mothers side, going back to WW1..  On my fathers side..  My great grandfather came to this country when he was 6 years old. One of his fondest memories, was standing at the rail of the ship, and seeing the statue of liberty materialize out of the fog as they came into the harbor. He talked about that until the day he died. It is one of the few stories I remember him telling.  His father fought in WW1, on the wrong side, his son, my grandfather spoke fluent German, but was a gunner in a liberator.  When they sent his crew to Brit, they pulled my Grandfather off of his plane, and grilled him for over an hour about his loyalties..   They eventually decided to put him back on his plane, which is what he wanted...  two months later his plane was shot down over Hamburg..   Our German uncles and cousins delivered all but the co pilot into the hands of the French, who returned them all to allied care...    Four months later, the same thing happened again, and only three of them survived, my grandfather being one of them. 
   My Grandfather on my mothers side was in the Navy when WW2 arrived, and when the war ended came back to this little bitty town to live out his life.. thankfully...
   My Grandfathers hunted, and enjoyed shooting sports, and just shooting in general..  That is where I got my love for shooting..  My father.. well, he enjoyed riding around in the truck looking for a rabbit...  So I usually went hunting by myself or with my buddies..  small town school..  about 12 kids per class.. we had NRA classes in the gym, with bullet traps for the .22's  spiral snail looking things you put a target on the front of..  so, we carried our .22's to school, put them in our locker, and put the box of shells on the shelf..  Many times we did this, not because we had NRA classes, but because we were going squirrel hunting after school...  carry a gun into a school today and see what happens...
   Why is that?  WHY is everyone punished, for the misdeeds of a few?   I always understood, that Prior restraint was illegal?

   My son once got kicked out of his school..   Using the words GUN or KILL was not allowed...     He got a new .22 and I took him hunting..   (I was the one that gave him his hunter safety course)   He got two squirrels, which I grilled for us to share..  he told his friends this at school, and was quickly expelled...
    I was beyond angry, and I hired a lawyer, charges were raised, and the school system very quickly backed down.  If my son had told someone he was going to bring his gun to school and kill them, I could have understood....

   What my grandfathers have fought for, my family, myself, my son, cousins, uncles etc....   Is NOT what this country is becoming.   The sad part of it is, those screaming the loudest, havent the slightest clue what it is they are doing, the lifestyle they are destroying, for no better reason, than to lay the blame for the worlds problems on inanimate objects, rather than blame and punish the people who use them for illegitimate purposes.
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Online iddee

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2015, 11:01:14 AM »
Where's the good post icon?
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

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Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2015, 12:17:51 PM »
BRAVO, OldMech! 
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Dallasbeek

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2015, 12:44:28 PM »
Old,
I own a preschool.  I wish I could teach the same lesson your kids (and mine) know to others. 

Don't try it.   Some hoplophobic nitwit would raise a stink. 

One of the pleasures in my life was being a volunteer hunter safety instructor with the New Mexico Department of Game and Fish when I lived in Albuquerque.  There was no shooting instruction.  Only classroom stuff, but at least they learned the basics that a lot of older hunters seem not to know.

  Now I take a few friends at a time to a local range to introduce them to shooting handguns of various types.  These are mostly seniors like myself, but some have never shot a pistol before.  One guy had been an Air Force officer who regularly carried a 1911 when doing payroll duty, but had never fired one (how the Air Force trains troops without at least exposing them to firearms is beside me; I was trained on the range in AFROTC in college, but served in the army, so I don't know  how they do it in the Air Force).  He actually was a pretty good shooter once he got the hang of it. 
« Last Edit: March 27, 2015, 03:14:11 PM by Dallasbeek »
"Liberty lives in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no laws, no court can save it." - Judge Learned Hand, 1944

Offline Hi-Tech

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2015, 05:32:31 PM »
He shot, he just didn't pay attention. As an Air Force vet, I was trained on any weapon I ever carried...

As a kid, we played guns, cowboys and Indians, army, secret agent and all kinds of other violent games with toy guns. we shot each other with bb guns, sling shots, toy guns or just threw rocks at each other. What we didn't do was get our parents gun or even our own guns out without permission. Why not? Because at 8 years old I respected guns? No. For two reasons.. first, guns were for hunting or target shooting, not for playing cowboys and Indians. Second? My dad would have beat the tee total hell out of me. And we didn't have mass shootings? I wonder why?

I have been around guns all my life. At a very early age I knew about them and what they were for. They were a tool, not a toy. My uncle let me shoot his 12 gauge (00 Buck, 3 inch mag) when I was 7. You couldn't have paid me to touch that gun again for at least 5 years. LOL
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Online iddee

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2015, 06:29:10 PM »
I was late getting started. I wasn't allowed to go hunting with the family .410 until I was seven. A loaded gun on our property meant a belt bringing blood with each and every swing. We loaded them when we got off our land and into the woods. Unloaded before we left the woods.
"Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me . . . Anything can happen, child. Anything can be"

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Offline OldMech

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2015, 10:13:15 PM »

   I had my fair share of welts. At the time, it HURT, and made me angry, and fearful...  so in effect, it worked!  Looking back, i haev NO arguments with any welt I ever recieved. i actually deserved a few more than i got...
    STANDING beside your desk at school was humiliating!
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Online sawdstmakr

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2015, 08:40:48 AM »
Where's the good post icon?
For this one we need a Great post.
Jim
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Offline jvalentour

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2015, 10:34:24 PM »
My uncle let me shoot his 12 gauge (00 Buck, 3 inch mag) when I was 7. You couldn't have paid me to touch that gun again for at least 5 years. LOL

HiTech, I still have a scar under my right eye from firing my first 12 guage.  Like you, it was a long time before I shot a shotgun again. 

Killing an animal with a weapon brings a somber reality to the power of a gun.  Most people who use them respect life.  Sadly, others do not.

Offline Joe D

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2015, 01:59:11 AM »
Hi-Tech, the fellow may not have, when I was in boot camp when it came time for our company to go to the firing range, we went but because of some reason we didn't shoot anything.  We did go through the classes and dry fire, but we didn't do any shooting.  Being a Vietnam Vet I did get to shoot after boot camp though.

I got my first gun at 6, and when I was 13 bought my first gun that I paid for.  Yep back then guns weren't registered and I don't guess age mattered that much either.  I went to our local Sears and Roebucks and bought the gun I had been eyeing for sometime, a Ted Williams 12 gauge pump, ribbed barrel and poly choke.  It was a fairly light gun and if you were shooting upwards much, you could hold the tube nut and it would eject and reload itself when shot.  When my kids were growing up, we hunted, and I told them to treat all guns as if they were loaded along with the other things on safe handling.

Joe D


Offline GSF

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2015, 06:51:59 AM »
This is rabbit trailing from the OP but I heard a great line from one of the people from "The Last Alaskans(?)". He said, "Nothing dies in the wild from old age, everything dies a violent death." That of course is without guns. Sometimes shooting it is the most humane way for it to die, quick.
When the law no longer protects you from the corrupt, but protects the corrupt from you - then you know your nation is doomed.

Offline gww

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2015, 11:26:48 AM »
Our whole class got hunters safety in school.  I can't remember what grade but it was in grade school.  I took a Remington 20 gage simi-auto to class that day so we could go to the range for the shooting portion of the class.  I do think this,  if hunter safety is required, it should be taught in public school.  My view is that it should not be required the way it is done now.  You have to pay to go and that makes it more about money then hunter safety.

If they make a law that to hunt you have to have it then it should be taught in school.

I really don't know which caused which.  When I grew up we used to sleep in the park and sneak into the fair but you had to buy tickets for the rides.  It did get wilder then it should have on halloween.  I joined the army at 17 and when I came back three years later they had a fence around the park and a curfew of 10:00 pm.  Got a ticket almost my first day back.  The rides at the fair were free but you had to pay a lot to see them.  One of the first things we did was get drunk and ride around and climb the poles that the curfew signs were on and rip a bunch of them down.

I might have did a few donuts in the park before the curfew but never really had that destructive feeling I had after receiving a ticket for something I had did all my life.

Now kids get introuble for taking an aspirin for a head ache.

I don't really know which came first, more rules that piss people off or to much wildness causing more rules.

I pretty much stay home or go where I feel comfortable and only venture out in main stream society when I need something or it would be rude not to show up cause people you love are going to be there and are expecting me.

That is one of the reasons I think getting bees may fit with my life stile now.

Again, I am not sure which caused what.
Cheers
gww

PS  I remember going to class with a bloody nose cause I got in a fight in the hall. Nothing was said.  One time I got in a fight in the lunch room and my punishment was to write a ten page report on the art of boxing.  There was no such thing as zero tolerance and the law had to be brought in.  Now you are in big trouble for little things so you might as well do something big.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2015, 11:40:11 AM by gww »

Offline kathyp

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2015, 11:35:33 AM »
Quote
hoplophobic nitwit

I am keeping this one.

We had guns around all the time.  we were taught to use them, but told not to touch them without permission.  Only one time did I break the rule and that was to run someone out of the backyard when I was babysitting my younger sibs. 

My dad taught me to plink cans with the .22 and when he thought I was old enough, we moved to the shotgun.  My little sister was making a little sister PIA of herself begging to shoot the 12 gauge.  Knowing what the outcome would be, he put only one shell in for her, and let her get knocked on her backside.  Good lesson for all of us.   :grin:

Of course, we were brought up in a time where there were no "safe spaces", and no "micro-aggression".  We were expected to grow up, move out, and earn a living.  We wanted to be able to protect ourselves and our own and not be dependent on someone else to maybe do the job for us.
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Offline OldMech

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #20 on: December 26, 2015, 10:19:54 PM »
Well said!
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Offline 1frozenhillbilly

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Re: Kids and guns
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2016, 06:14:19 AM »
living in somewhat rural alaska my shotgun set in the corner behind the kitchen door the whole time my kids were growing up (loaded too) and all three very quickly learned you don't touch that, as they got old enough they were taught how to clear a weapon and then how to use one. we never had one incident (as far as i know even after their mother and i separated) and each of them has a gun of her own now that they are grown and gone.  i have to agree with the op,  any of my three would have gone oh another gun and went back to what ever they were doing.
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