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Author Topic: Warre Hives  (Read 1404 times)

Offline bwallace23350

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Warre Hives
« on: February 18, 2017, 05:48:32 PM »
What are the advantages of the Warre Hive? I have been looking into it and if I can catch a swarm I might put it in a Warre Hive. Is this smart or should I stay with the Langstroth?

Offline gww

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2017, 06:27:45 PM »
bw
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What are the advantages of the Warre Hive?

You ask that like you already think there are advantages of a warre hive. 
Naugh, I'm just razzing you.  I built one.  I don't know if I will ever put bees in it or not.  I did put it out and put some lemon grass oil in it just in case.  I think about the only thing someone might think about a warre hive is that if you only want a hive or two for your garden and atmosphere cause they look cool.  I don't have glass in mine. 

If you use the fixed frame and due to the size differrance, I think most that are really trying to make money from bees find that warres don't fit thier management style and size of other equiptment.  Some will say it is illegal. 

I will just take abby at his word if I decide to put some bees in mine.  I am just playing.
Good luck
gww

Offline sawdstmakr

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2017, 06:42:43 AM »
"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed.  If you do read the newspaper you are misinformed."--Mark Twain

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2017, 09:20:13 AM »
Thanks. If I did get one I would get one with the glass in it so I could watch it.

Offline little john

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2017, 10:41:19 AM »
Unless you're going to adopt the Warre style of beekeeping (minimal interference, just two inspections a year, etc), I can't really see the point of having one Warre hive amongst an apiary full of Langstroths - because - nothing is interchangeable with any other hive and so there can be no mutual support between them (by the swapping of combs and such-like).

If you already have 8-frame Langstroth boxes, then you can very easily make a 'near-enough' Warre hive by simply adding a quilt box.  Then - you can play with nadiring, and the other Warre oddities to see if that style of beekeeping is for you  (it's about a style of beekeeping, not just about boxes).  Should it then press the right buttons for you, then you could go ahead and made several Warre hives, but without incurring any outlay whilst you're checking it out.
LJ
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Offline bwallace23350

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2017, 07:47:45 PM »
Thanks

Offline TheBroodLord

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2017, 05:41:13 AM »
Unless you're going to adopt the Warre style of beekeeping (minimal interference, just two inspections a year, etc), I can't really see the point of having one Warre hive amongst an apiary full of Langstroths - because - nothing is interchangeable with any other hive and so there can be no mutual support between them (by the swapping of combs and such-like).
LJ

Is it actually doable to only inspect twice a year? Warre wrote his book in a very different time period (for bees and humans).

Offline little john

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2017, 10:50:02 AM »
Unless you're going to adopt the Warre style of beekeeping (minimal interference, just two inspections a year, etc), I can't really see the point of having one Warre hive amongst an apiary full of Langstroths - because - nothing is interchangeable with any other hive and so there can be no mutual support between them (by the swapping of combs and such-like).
LJ

Is it actually doable to only inspect twice a year? Warre wrote his book in a very different time period (for bees and humans).

Not just a different time period, but in a very specific environment too - that of rural France, where the farms are small, most of which are still run 'in the old way', with plenty of hedgerows etc.  A million miles away from modern intensive prairie-style mono-cropping.

Really couldn't say whether it's still do-able or not - even in rural France - that's something that only a dyed-in-the-wool Warre enthusiast could comment on.  I do have four 8-frame Warre-lookalike hives (with British National frames - same as in all my other hives) ready to be occupied, come Spring - maybe those will be able to answer the question ?
LJ
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Offline herbhome

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2017, 02:06:39 PM »
I have Warres and 8-frame lang.
One advantage is smaller boxes, easier on the back. 8-frame mediums are about the same though.
Second is natural comb drawing, that is a debatable issue but I like it. I run foundationless in my langs also.
Third, and maybe more important is they are square, helping with wintering. Bees in cluster are never far from stores.

An internet search will show that in France and Australia there are many commercial keeps using Warres. In most of the cases I have found they use modified Warres with frames without bottom bars. This also settles any problems with legality. They add 1-1/4 to the depth of the box to keep the volume equal.

Offline paus

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2017, 10:33:06 PM »
I have asked this question before "What is a quilt box concerning a bee hive"?. 

Offline herbhome

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2017, 10:56:42 PM »
I have asked this question before "What is a quilt box concerning a bee hive"?.

A quilt box is essentially a shallow super, though it can be shallower, with a permeable material attached to the bottom. I use burlap, but muslin and even hardware cloth work. In winter, the quilt is filled with straw, shavings, shredded paper, even sawdust. As moist warm air rises up it slows the transfer of heat and absorbs moisture keeping it from condensing and dripping down on the cluster. I use cedar chips in mine. I've heard paper and straw can make a moldy mess.
Hope that answers your question. :smile:

Offline paus

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2017, 11:11:49 PM »
Thanks that answers my question.  Harbor freight has movers quilts, at a very reasonable price, that could be cut up and used. I think I may use some of these in weaker hives and also in strong hives hmmm, maybe in all of them.  Is a top board normally used also?  Then the shavings can be used in smokers in the spring.

Offline herbhome

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2017, 12:08:14 AM »
Generally the inner cover on a Warre is a mat. It is just material that can breathe. I use a piece of burlap taped on the edge to a piece of 1/8 hardware cloth. The hardware cloth goes bee side down. This keeps the bees from gnawing at the material. It is placed over the top bars of the top box. Then the quilt box. Then the outer cover. From time to time throughout the winter one needs to lift the cover and feel around in the fill. If it is soggy, replace it.
I'm not sure that an actual quilt would serve this purpose.

Offline bwallace23350

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2017, 06:56:19 AM »
Unless you're going to adopt the Warre style of beekeeping (minimal interference, just two inspections a year, etc), I can't really see the point of having one Warre hive amongst an apiary full of Langstroths - because - nothing is interchangeable with any other hive and so there can be no mutual support between them (by the swapping of combs and such-like).
LJ

Is it actually doable to only inspect twice a year? Warre wrote his book in a very different time period (for bees and humans).

Not just a different time period, but in a very specific environment too - that of rural France, where the farms are small, most of which are still run 'in the old way', with plenty of hedgerows etc.  A million miles away from modern intensive prairie-style mono-cropping.

Really couldn't say whether it's still do-able or not - even in rural France - that's something that only a dyed-in-the-wool Warre enthusiast could comment on.  I do have four 8-frame Warre-lookalike hives (with British National frames - same as in all my other hives) ready to be occupied, come Spring - maybe those will be able to answer the question ?
LJ

The environment I might be able to replicate and to an extent I probably already have. I might eventually give it a shot but it will not be this year

Offline Michael Bush

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2017, 08:55:46 AM »
Abbe' Warre's goal was to design a hive that was cheap and easy for people to build and easy for people to manage.  As mentioned above most of the advantages as far as light boxes, natural comb and boxes whose width fits the cluster of bees in the winter, you can get with eight frame mediums and foundationless frames.  Part of Warre's management style, though is to add boxes to the bottom instead of the top and to maintain the "scent" and warmth of the brood nest.  Of course you could do those things with eight frame mediums as well.
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Offline bwallace23350

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2017, 11:33:08 AM »
Abbe' Warre's goal was to design a hive that was cheap and easy for people to build and easy for people to manage.  As mentioned above most of the advantages as far as light boxes, natural comb and boxes whose width fits the cluster of bees in the winter, you can get with eight frame mediums and foundationless frames.  Part of Warre's management style, though is to add boxes to the bottom instead of the top and to maintain the "scent" and warmth of the brood nest.  Of course you could do those things with eight frame mediums as well.

Thanks so there is really no advantage to it.

Offline gww

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2017, 11:53:11 AM »
Bw......
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Thanks so there is really no advantage to it

I don't know, they look really cool, that is an advantage of sorts.  Fixed frames and no lost space due to side bars of a frame was an advantage in abby warres mind.
Cheers
gww

Offline herbhome

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2017, 10:49:07 PM »
Another advantage is they are ridiculously easy to build. :smile:

Offline gww

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2017, 12:29:20 AM »
herbhome
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Another advantage is they are ridiculously easy to build

I only found one dissadvantage strictly from my perspective.  I cut my own lumber and my target board size is eight inches and honostly, eight inches is what the quality of logs I deal with reflect.  The warre is like 8.5 inches wide board and so I find it harder to come up with the proper lumber or I would probly build more of them. 

One other thing that abby was promoting is the square shape was closer to a round shape and so better.
Cheers
gww

Offline Acebird

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Re: Warre Hives
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2017, 10:02:45 AM »
I think there is a reason why Warre hives are not that popular with today's beekeeper.  There is too much work to keep them from swarming, there is too much work to harvest honey and without a frame going through the hive is time consuming.  Nadiring guarantees that their will be brood cocoons in the combs of honey.
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