Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum
BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => GENERAL BEEKEEPING - MAIN POSTING FORUM. => Topic started by: JP on January 19, 2009, 09:25:30 pm
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I went in to the feed store on Saturday and there was honey on the counter. 1 LBers were $3.25 and $9.25 for 40oz. I told the owner these prices were very cheap for a local beekeeper's honey. He said that's what everyone's been telling him.
...JP
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Sometimes deciding a on price can be tricky. What some may think is exhorbitant others will consider fair value, what some considered underpriced others will consider expensive. What a rural person will pay is not the same as what a city slicker will pay. My take: decide on what is believed to be a reasonable price, if it sells well, bump it up. When it gets to the point it doesn't sell or sells very little drop the price back to the previous price and you have it set for your market.
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Forgot to mention this was in Ms.
...JP
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Forgot to mention this was in Ms.
...JP
Guess that explains it!! :) :) :)
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I've been saying for years I'm surprised some just don't give it away. Afterall, I see beekeepers providing free pollination all the time. Oh wait, let me change this. I have seen beekeepers afterall give their honey away, in exchange for a honey site, conveniently located and in conjunction with pollinating that farmers field. I guess there really is nothing for "free",...... some get paid for it also. :-D
I agree...the honey is too cheap!
And before someone claims that not all beekeepers get ABJ or Bee Culture, I'll admit that point. But for anyone willing to do a sliver of market research, they conveniently list all the regions and the prices as reported by a good number of beekeepers. In the January report, the low for a 1 pound container was $3.91 for retail, and the top was $6.19 for retail. So to put this into reality, this beekeeper is actually selling below every reporting beekeeper across the country. There is actually not ONE beekeeper selling this low. NOT ONE!
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I wonder how much he is paying for his jars on top of that.
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>>>>In the January report, the low for a 1 pound container was $3.91 for retail, and the top was $6.19 for retail.<<<<
Seems to me like the researchers didn't check in MS., or they would have found the same honey JP did. I wonder how many other low priced areas they missed.
With a little variance, it is selling for 5.00 a pint and 10.00 a quart in this area.
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I'm getting $6.00 for a pint with no trouble but that's in a glass mason jar that costs about $0.75
Dave
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So let me get this straight....all beekeepers are selling their honey in Mississippi for prices around 3.25 a pound, as JP found. But JP also acknowledged the store owner said that everyone stated the prices were too low.
Let's see....the consumer buying public states the honey is too low. And the beekeepers are selling it at what could only be suggested as "at loss" prices.
I know some in Mississippi are slow. Some are downright stupid. But there must be someone able to connect dots when the buying consumers all agree that the honey is being sold way below what anyone expects to pay.
As for this pint and quart pricing...let me give you some advice. The average person, including consumers, could not tell you how many pounds of honey are in a pint. And I bet some beekeepers even after filling the pints and quarts could not state what they are getting per pound. Your better off selling in something the average consumer can relate too, that being a pound jar. It may not help the buyer, but it might just help those poor beekeepers who are selling their honey way less than what they should.
A five dollar pint, come to about 3.64 a pound. And if you can't get 4 dollars a pound for local raw honey, maybe you should give up beekeeping. Do it for yourself. Do it for your family. Your better off flipping hamburgers.
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If they want to sell the honey for that price, good for them! If they sell out, then that is their business. If they can make a living selling honey for that price, well maybe we should all be talking to them.
Because of people like that, there are a lot of extra people eating honey that wouldn't eat honey if it is $15 for a quart or $6 for a honeybear. And local, so a lot of people get the taste for local honey and will stop to buy yours quicker too if they see it.
Here's were I get a bit wound up....
You are all assuming that all beekeeping is a business. For most of us its not...its a hobby. A HOBBY. And done for the enjoyment of the bees. I have to deal with the honey. I HATE sales. I couldn't sell heaters to an eskimo. I just don't like selling stuff, its not me. So you expect me to give up beekeeping because I hate selling stuff???
Plus, I have a reletively large family and am on a tight budget. I don't buy "extras" if I can't afford them, and honey is an "extra". Most of the families that I know are in the same boat.
At a local farmers co-op I can get local maple syrup for $9/qt. I've never seen it that cheap, most of the time it is $20-$30 a quart. Because of this, I can now eat maple syrup on a semi-regular basis, something I'd not normally do. I'm thankful for that. If I can do that for some other families with honey, then that makes me happy.
So I have no problem selling my honey for $7/quart, even if everybody thinks that is a travesty. I know that there are a lot of people eating a lot more honey than they would, and I have a great hobby. Shucks, if I can break even on a hobby, then that is one great hobby!!!
Besides that, do you know how many beekeepers that there are with buckets of honey in their basement that they just give away or have no idea what to do with? Better at $5/quart than to just throw it away.
I'm guessing that there are a lot of hobby-ists that have enough honey to stock the feed store. People don't go to the feed store to by fancy high-fallutin honey.
I'd hate flipping hamburgers, but sure do love flipping frames.
Rick
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It all depends on how much honey the keeper produces-most everybody would not sell honey for $1.20 a pound- but most arnt selling there crop wholsale to packers in drums-$1.20-$1.50 is what honey goes to packers for-this beek may be tickeld pink to get double his money for a couple of drums-for all we know -by the way JP did you buy a jar? :lol: i always like to sample honey that comes from local beeks 8-) RDY-B
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I hear your point Rick. But the flip side of that coin is the small time beekeeper who IS TRYING to make a few dollars for his family. He has a few kids and a mortgage that is due and he cant afford to buy maple syrup at 9.00 a qt. All he wants to do is sell his honey at a fair price so he does not lose money with his bees (which his wife is angry about anyway) and be able to have a few hundred extra dollars in his pocket to spend on his family. Then they guy next door, who probably does not need the extra money is selling his honey for next to nothing. In doing so he saturates the market with cheep honey and the guy trying to make a few extra bucks is shut out because if he can not turn a profit he looses his bees because he can not afford them.
I give honey away to people I know who can not afford it, and I will cut prices from time to time for my return customers but I know in doing so I am not taking a sale away from anyone else. I see both sides but I think if you just need to rid yourself of honey. wholesale it to someone else so you are not making it hard for the next guy trying to keep his bees and make a few dollars.
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So who is the bad guy the poor keeper or the dumb store owner-or are they one and the same :-D RDY-B
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So who is the bad guy the poor keeper or the dumb store owner-or are they one and the same :-D RDY-B
If they are splitting the profit, if any, then I would say both. The buying community already told them that.
If the beekeeper is getting all of the profit, then it is the storeowner.
As for "high-fallutin" honey.....just because a beekeeper marks his honey at a fair price, taking into account his time, cost, and wants to put a few dollars on his families table, there is nothing wrong with that. Call it "high-fallutin" if you want. But I know local raw honey should be selling for more than supermarket honey.
As for this notion that a beekeeper should lower his honey to ridiculously low proces in attempts to expand the market selling to people who can not afford it otherwise......wait a minute, that sounds like your selling mortgages... :shock:
I'll talk to the wife about lowering my prices to sell twice as much, for the goodness of the market. Although we would not be making a pennie, I'll try to sell her the idea that all should have some, and selling below market prices (As the buying consumers are telling the store owner and beekeeper) will give us that nice warm fuzzy feeling.
rdb-b, at least you give a choice of the two options. A "poor" beekeeper, and a "dumb" store owner.
I'm all for people doing whatever they want. I'm also for telling you what I think about it. Don't like my opinion on thinking the beekeeper AND store owner are idiots? Then take a lesson, and listen to what the buying community already said. They have said, according to the store owner, that the public was nice enough to suggest that the honey is selling for way LESS than what is expected. We can debate about unknown crap like "maybe" this beekeeper has a bucket in his basement, etc. But the one fact in this is the buyers have already spoken. And the honey is below what the local market calls for and dictates. And if the beekeeper and store owner can't listen to the market, then they are doomed anyways.
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AW, Com'on, Bjorn,tell us how you really feel. :-* :-D
I don't sell for resale, nor set up at stands. I only sell when someone asks. I do check prices any where they sell local honey. I didn't quote my prices above, I just said that is the average prices I see in this area.
I'm guessing that any beek that sells for less than production costs is either going to go out of business soon, or only sells a few jars each year. Either way, he isn't going to hurt the market for other beeks.
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Wow.
There are some things in here that I would not want said about me. I hope you all don't talk about me like this when I'm not around.
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AW, Com'on, Bjorn,tell us how you really feel. :-* :-D
I don't sell for resale, nor set up at stands. I only sell when someone asks. I do check prices any where they sell local honey. I didn't quote my prices above, I just said that is the average prices I see in this area.
I'm guessing that any beek that sells for less than production costs is either going to go out of business soon, or only sells a few jars each year. Either way, he isn't going to hurt the market for other beeks.
iddee,
read the "sister" thread I just made. I think he hurts the market just as much as what many say about foriegn honey.
1of6,
Of course we talk about you. What do you think the private messages are for.... :buttkick:
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>I know some in Mississippi are slow. Some are downright stupid.
Was this honey in Macon Ms.? :evil: :-D ;)
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:jawdrop:
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Just a couple of observations about selling honey. I sell "raw honey" for $2.50 per pound + container. I get comments all the time from cutomers about how inexpensive my honey is. I tell them that if they would like to pay more I'd certainly accept it, they never do.
I produce 60,000-65,000 LBS per year and sell it all from my honey house from April til Nov.
I get beekeepers stop in all the time, the conversation is always the same. The first 15 minutes they moan about not being able to sell their honey, they spend the next 15 minutes telling me how I should be selling mine.
I make a very good living and actually enjoy giving people excellent value for their money.
I guess I'm one of the dumb ones :)
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Just a couple of observations about selling honey. I sell "raw honey" for $2.50 per pound + container. I get comments all the time from cutomers about how inexpensive my honey is. I tell them that if they would like to pay more I'd certainly accept it, they never do.
I produce 60,000-65,000 LBS per year and sell it all from my honey house from April til Nov.
I get beekeepers stop in all the time, the conversation is always the same. The first 15 minutes they moan about not being able to sell their honey, they spend the next 15 minutes telling me how I should be selling mine.
I make a very good living and actually enjoy giving people excellent value for their money.
I guess I'm one of the dumb ones :)
Dumb, I don't know. Sounds like anyone pushing through $150,000 dollars in sales from your honey house is doing something right. Do tell.....are you suggesting your selling 60,000 one pound containers to consumers stopping in and driving by? Or are you selling your $150 buckets to other beekeepers, butchers, bakers, etc? In which case that is a little different than bottling up, labeling, carting off, and selling at markets.
I'll probably never take on more markets than I have now. Much more proffitable to sell buckets to the endless supply of beekeepers needing buckets to fill their own markets. I've told my wife if we ever decide to produce more honey, we would sell, in the bucket, cash and carry, and will probably still be sold out. But that is a bit different than the marketing model than selling it to the buying public in smaller containers, etc. Bulk sales come with a discount.
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Quote from Bjorn--- "As for "high-fallutin" honey.....just because a beekeeper marks his honey at a fair price, taking into account his time, cost, and wants to put a few dollars on his families table, there is nothing wrong with that. Call it "high-fallutin" if you want. But I know local raw honey should be selling for more than supermarket honey."
^ in red was the point of this post.
I did not buy any of this honey on that day because I felt the price was too low, I would have if it were a little more appropriately priced. It just didn't feel right to me. I looked it over real good and in fact wondered if something was perhaps wrong with it for the price to be so low for locally harvested honey.
This particular store owner is not an idiot, he is far from it and I consider him a friend, and this is why I told him the price was very cheap and this is when he said "this is what everyones been saying" and "I don't really even know what we paid for it." Which leads me to believe that perhaps his wife paid for the honey.
As a beekeeper and a patron of this guy's store, I felt it was my duty to mention the prices were very cheap. What I didn't expect was his response about agreeing they were cheap.
I don't know what the going rate is in that area but I mentioned to him that across the board it is not uncommon to pay $6.00 lb for raw local honey, as it is the good stuff, premium honey, which commands a higher price.
...JP
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JP,
I agree. Some of those concerns were pointed out in the other thread I made this morning concerning this.
When I see honey selling cheaper than what I know it took most to produce, red flags do go off.
As a example of public perception, look at these two situations.
Honey seller # one, is a vegetable seller with a nice setup at the market. He sells his honey for a friend, and has the honey located at the end of the table, but where all can see.
Honey seller #2, sets up a full length 8 foot table. It is packed with various bottles of honey. It has many bottles of different sizes and types. He also sells it for about 1 dollar more than the guy down the aisle.
I've talked to sellers in the first category. And I have been that #2 seller.
Reality is, seller #1, although selling many thousands of dollars in produce, averages 5 bottles on a Saturday morning. Seller #2, although his honey is priced higher, sells (as I have done) on average over 300 dollars worth of honey.
Yes, more were attracted to the honey table, in comparison to the honey bottles next to the produce. But the honey stand, is part of the marketing plan. Having someone be able to talk about it, explain it, and answer questions about bees, all make sales. But it also is the perception of the buyers. They perceive the honey stand as THE place to buy honey, and will pay a higher price.
Here is another example....
I go to flea markets on a regular basis. I see those once or twice a year setups where they are cleaning out the garage, etc. And some of these places, there is always a few bags of cucumbers, maybe the very overgrown squash, and some backyard grown tomatoes that the wife thinks it would be good to sell. Maybe it's just me (but I know it's not since I ask many people such things) but I still find myself buying produce from the vegetable stand where they are actually in the business of selling produce. Even though the cucumbers are cheaper at the family setup next to the bags of baby clothes, and unwanted toys, I still for some unknown reason buy from the veggie stand down the aisle.
People see low prices, something less than what they should be buying it at, and people do have all kinds of perceptions. It's crazy if you think about it...
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Just a couple of observations about selling honey. I sell "raw honey" for $2.50 per pound + container. I get comments all the time from cutomers about how inexpensive my honey is. I tell them that if they would like to pay more I'd certainly accept it, they never do.
I produce 60,000-65,000 LBS per year and sell it all from my honey house from April til Nov.
I get beekeepers stop in all the time, the conversation is always the same. The first 15 minutes they moan about not being able to sell their honey, they spend the next 15 minutes telling me how I should be selling mine.
I make a very good living and actually enjoy giving people excellent value for their money.
I guess I'm one of the dumb ones :)
Dumb, I don't know. Sounds like anyone pushing through $150,000 dollars in sales from your honey house is doing something right. Do tell.....are you suggesting your selling 60,000 one pound containers to consumers stopping in and driving by? Or are you selling your $150 buckets to other beekeepers, butchers, bakers, etc? In which case that is a little different than bottling up, labeling, carting off, and selling at markets.
I'll probably never take on more markets than I have now. Much more proffitable to sell buckets to the endless supply of beekeepers needing buckets to fill their own markets. I've told my wife if we ever decide to produce more honey, we would sell, in the bucket, cash and carry, and will probably still be sold out. But that is a bit different than the marketing model than selling it to the buying public in smaller containers, etc. Bulk sales come with a discount.
It's all sold to the consumers. I have been in the same location for 25 yrs so the sales have grown over the years.
I never discount the price. 1 pound or 100, the price is still $2.50. My average sale is 15 lbs. I've found that the casual honey eater tends to buy their 3 lbs a year from the grocery store.
Loyal customers are money in the bank.
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My loyal customers pay cash, and it does not go to the bank..... :-D
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My loyal customers pay cash, and it does not go to the bank..... :-D
BINGO! :-D
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Everyone presumes it is truly local raw honey, as opposed to something from abroad. Maybe the store owner doesn't even know it. Maybe a local beek is buying from China?
I only sell retail. I charge $7/lb or 4 for $24, $3 for a 6oz bear or 4 for $10. I will disocunt larger orders a little. I wont go below 4.50/lb. Everything costs more when you're a smaller beekeeper as you cant leverage better costs on supplies and other costs are spread out or amoritized over fewer pounds of honey.I cant make enough honey to sell so I buy from another beek whom I trust and resell. I dont make as much, but I keeep my customers from going elsewhere. I also give lots of honey away and do free removals for the elderly.
It is true that local honey should demand a better price than Walmart honey, but many people wont. You have to find the right local market. I call them the "granola crowd" The granola crwod will pay the most, particularly if they are from a more urban environment. I even sell honey from tree removals as "wildbee honey." I get $10/lb. I cant get enough of it.
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Everyone presumes it is truly local raw honey, as opposed to something from abroad. Maybe the store owner doesn't even know it. Maybe a local beek is buying from China?
I only sell retail. I charge $7/lb or 4 for $24, $3 for a 6oz bear or 4 for $10. I will disocunt larger orders a little. I wont go below 4.50/lb. Everything costs more when you're a smaller beekeeper as you cant leverage better costs on supplies and other costs are spread out or amoritized over fewer pounds of honey.I cant make enough honey to sell so I buy from another beek whom I trust and resell. I dont make as much, but I keeep my customers from going elsewhere. I also give lots of honey away and do free removals for the elderly.
It is true that local honey should demand a better price than Walmart honey, but many people wont. You have to find the right local market. I call them the "granola crowd" The granola crwod will pay the most, particularly if they are from a more urban environment. I even sell honey from tree removals as "wildbee honey." I get $10/lb. I cant get enough of it.
The beekeeper was local out of Bougue Chitto.
...JP
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I don't know the details of the beekeeper. He/she may have had enough to get rid of but they don't like sitting at farmers markets selling to the granola crowd. Maybe a bigger producer but wants to make a little extra local money without selling their honey wholesale.
As I said, this is a feed store, and if my local feed stores are any indication, the honey is probably priced for that market. That beekeeper is likely still making money on it, at a margin they are comfortable with. Sure, can probably get a little more for the honey, but likely wouldn't sell as much either. I hope that there are a lot of people enjoying local honey, if that is what it is, from that feed store.
My opinion? This is honey, not gold. Sell it for whatever price you think that you can get it for. If you are a better sales person than me, then you will get more for it, congratulations. The more, the better. But please don't insult people for selling it for less. We all have our reasons, just like you have yours.
That is called capitalism. :-D
If they are selling imported honey as raw, local, then yes, I agree that that is wrong. That has been mentioned but not proven. I'm assuming this isn't the case.
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i use A LOT of honey and no day is quite good unless I have several tablespoons for my tea or lemonade. My own hives are just entering their 2nd year - fingers crossed I will soon be self sufficient in this matter.
That said, I have long watched the price of honey because I am so dependent on it for my joy!
In California, honey prices have gone through the roof. I am so lucky to find it at $9/quart (3lbs) at a feed store 50 miles north, but at my neighboorhood markets (which are over inflated in all respects ...) the price for a locally produced quart is (brace yourself) $16 - for a quart! :'(The cheep stuff is over $12 quart. Even a local beek at the farmers market was charging 13$ for a quart w/no price break, even on a gallon!
Seems like gold...might be worth the drive from Missisippi...? :roll:
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A florist a few towns over from where we live is selling their 8 oz. jars for $6.99 each. We're selling our 8 oz. jars for $5 and our lb. jars for $8. Might take a little longer to sell but we've got to make some of our money back. Many of our customers have bought from us before.
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My point was (and I probably did a poor job of making it) was that there are a lot of variables in determining your selling price with volume being a major factor.
I'll go back to lurking now :-X
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...I'll go back to lurking now :-X
I'd like to see that NOT happen.
Sorry everyone.
It's time. I'll sit back and cool down for a little while and maybe get my thoughts a little straighter, then I'll post my thread in the intro section and explain my views on why I came over here to the Beemaster site. I really thought I was getting away from some of this by coming over here from the other site.
It's time we all had a talk about how we treat new members. What's the deal?? Did I end up on the wrong site?
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What are you guys talking about?... :idunno: And I'm serious. I see some difference of opinion, but nothing that could bring up images or comments about beesource.
I think the people reading the comments, are "reading" into them way too much.
Captaincanuck made some statements, I ask a follow up question about selling bulk, he explained where he was coming from, I agreed, we both like cash, and beyond that....what the heck am I missing?
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Um..I dont see a problem here. Sorry if anyone took my comments to be hostile toward anyone. I was just stating an opinion in a discussion. I did not get from these post that anyone was trying to belittle anyone for selling their honey however they wanted to. It is just a discussion on honey prices and the reason for it.
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In California, honey prices have gone through the roof. I am so lucky to find it at $9/quart (3lbs) at a feed store 50 miles north, but at my neighboorhood markets (which are over inflated in all respects ...) the price for a locally produced quart is (brace yourself) $16 - for a quart! :'(The cheep stuff is over $12 quart. Even a local beek at the farmers market was charging 13$ for a quart w/no price break, even on a gallon!
jojoroxx you are getting a great deal. I live in Sac. and I am selling mine for $7 a pound. So I guess that would make it $21 a quart. I also don't have any left sitting in the basement!
Quote from: rdy-b on January 19, 2009, 08:54:44 PM
So who is the bad guy the poor keeper or the dumb store owner-or are they one and the same RDY-B
If they are splitting the profit, if any, then I would say both. The buying community already told them that.
If the beekeeper is getting all of the profit, then it is the storeowner.
As for "high-fallutin" honey.....just because a beekeeper marks his honey at a fair price, taking into account his time, cost, and wants to put a few dollars on his families table, there is nothing wrong with that. Call it "high-fallutin" if you want. But I know local raw honey should be selling for more than supermarket honey.
As for this notion that a beekeeper should lower his honey to ridiculously low proces in attempts to expand the market selling to people who can not afford it otherwise......wait a minute, that sounds like your selling mortgages...
I'll talk to the wife about lowering my prices to sell twice as much, for the goodness of the market. Although we would not be making a pennie, I'll try to sell her the idea that all should have some, and selling below market prices (As the buying consumers are telling the store owner and beekeeper) will give us that nice warm fuzzy feeling.
rdb-b, at least you give a choice of the two options. A "poor" beekeeper, and a "dumb" store owner.
I'm all for people doing whatever they want. I'm also for telling you what I think about it. Don't like my opinion on thinking the beekeeper AND store owner are idiots? Then take a lesson, and listen to what the buying community already said. They have said, according to the store owner, that the public was nice enough to suggest that the honey is selling for way LESS than what is expected. We can debate about unknown crap like "maybe" this beekeeper has a bucket in his basement, etc. But the one fact in this is the buyers have already spoken. And the honey is below what the local market calls for and dictates. And if the beekeeper and store owner can't listen to the market, then they are doomed anyways.
DITTO! and Amen
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>>It's time. I'll sit back and cool down for a little while and maybe get my thoughts a little straighter, then I'll post my thread in the intro section and explain my views on why I came over here to the Beemaster site. I really thought I was getting away from some of this by coming over here from the other site.
It's time we all had a talk about how we treat new members. What's the deal?? Did I end up on the wrong site?
:? :shock: :? :-*
Back on the subject. I get $5 a pint trying to raise to $6. A friend of mine wholesales case pts for $45.
Not a big market--- he says if he goes in higher it crystallizes in the barrel.
Same with me just now trying to build a word of mouth market. Wish I could get about 6.5o to 7.00 a pt.
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As with any other time, I'll admit that I very well could be a little off. I'll try and keep an open mind. I will however say this though:
Anytime we say things in such a way as to make a new member want to stop posting, we've done something wrong. I don't care if it was was lack of tact, too much pressure, or whatever. Maybe we can save it for established members. I took your jest toward me as just that - pure jest.
However, when I see us (as a forum) cause someone to not want to post anymore, I feel that we've misbehaved a bit.
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Is it possible that beekeeper was just trying to raise enough quick cash to pay an overdue electric bill or house payment?
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My point was (and I probably did a poor job of making it) was that there are a lot of variables in determining your selling price with volume being a major factor.
I'll go back to lurking now :-X
I understand completely. And I only dream of the day I could push that much product, collect cash from repeat customers, while selling in bulk volume.
There are variables. That is why I asked the questions I did. And based on your responses, I got nothing more to say.... :-D
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Do we know that that was a regular price/item in the store? maybe the owner "inherited" it some how and just wanted it gone.
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No problem here.
I just wanted to point out to some of the newer beekeepers who may want to turn their hobby into a fulltime profession, that there is a middle ground between producing many truckloads of honey and selling it for $1.30 a pound and trying to move honey thru retailers at $5-6 a pound.
I'm not really interested in debating the merits of one method vs. another.
The reason I was going back to 'lurking" is because that's really all I had to say :-\
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I have yet to sell my honey (first year beekeeper who has given my first harvests to family and friends) so this is just rookie observation...I would say that the price commanded is a function of marketing and audience. My local health food store sells "natural, raw" honey in various forms and brands for $10 + per pound. Who do you want to market to? Allergy prone people who are looking for local product from a health benefit perspective? Flea market folks looking for something cheap to sweeten the tea? Wholesaling to other beekeepers? How does a company get $10/gram for honey that's used on dressings to heal wounds? It's the target market.
I have noticed a phenomenon that one of my mentors told me about which I resisted for a long time. My sales tend to increase when I raise the price. I think it's psychology. People value something more if it costs more.
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What I see is the same if it is to cheap people think there is something wrong somehow it is "cheap" I buy my honey from a beek that looks most like a beek. Well dressed neat nice layout. Not the cheapest.If I ever have enough to sell, I have taken pictures of his layout. To many kids neighbors and friends to have any to sell now. Soon. Everyone has a different idea what is best. The only way we can learn new ways is the to put up our ideas and sometimes get them shot down. I lurk a lot but sometimes I run my mouth. Now your turn. Good luck everyone and don't stop talking. Tony
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CaptainCanuck, can you update your location in your profile? It helps to know where everybody is. Thanks...
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i can see that if your producing 60,000 lbs of honey why you would want to sell it at the price you do and i can also see why some like myself would sell it at the $5-$7 / lb . The local market for me anyway is just at that price but i also want to re-invest into my bee's so the money i make will get me more bee's and wooden ware.
i think if i had 600-750 hives producing approximately $120,000 dollars worth of honey then i would be very happy and could see me selling it for similar price.
for now i'm not letting any of my honey go for less than $5/lb I've already got people asking me left right and center when my honey will be available for 2009 and can they buy it
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More Bees- :lol: 8-) RDY-B
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I'm getting $6.00 for a pint with no trouble but that's in a glass mason jar that costs about $0.75
Dave
That's what I sold mine for and we sold out. One guy bought a case...12 jars.
David
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Sorry everyone.
It's time. I'll sit back and cool down for a little while and maybe get my thoughts a little straighter, then I'll post my thread in the intro section and explain my views on why I came over here to the Beemaster site. I really thought I was getting away from some of this by coming over here from the other site.
It's time we all had a talk about how we treat new members. What's the deal?? Did I end up on the wrong site?
__________
I'd like to see that NOT happen.
As with any other time, I'll admit that I very well could be a little off. I'll try and keep an open mind. I will however say this though:
Anytime we say things in such a way as to make a new member want to stop posting, we've done something wrong. I don't care if it was was lack of tact, too much pressure, or whatever. Maybe we can save it for established members. I took your jest toward me as just that - pure jest.
However, when I see us (as a forum) cause someone to not want to post anymore, I feel that we've misbehaved a bit.
1of16 writes:
Members here are surely NOT going to be ANY HARSHER on new comers than established members - friendly is friendly, Aholes are Aholes. I don't know what this jab is (especially in a post where it has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC. We had a very pleasant PM once, pm me again if you have issues concerning new members or anyone.
Beemaster is NOT now nor EVER Will be Eutopia, and no one promised you this. It is not Woodsock, people don't lay around playing naked in the mud while Janis Joplin is on stage, if a new member gets tossed, it isn't a GROUP hand-raise decision. Sorry if you cannot agree with everything our small by interactive governing body works, it is what it is. A member who is choosing to leave us by breaking rules and choosing to fight RIGHT out of the gate. I been Administrating a long time, please don't pretend to know MY JOB.
The members here (whether you fully buy the concept or not) have great input concerning new members. It doesn't take long to see who people really are. We ask new members ESPECIALLY to be on good behaviour - maybe a few cabin fevered members can give them a little slack to in some posts, agreed.
I personally see a small influx of people from other forums who have agendas which I believe the members should be made aware - that's all. Not all new members are new beekeeps with great hopes and intentions, many are here on their 3 or 4 membername, they are forum DIRTY BOMBS, just trying to go off in our forum like a suiside bomber in a Iraqie MArket Place.We know threats exist and I enjoy you here greatly - I son't understand if I'm reading you incorrectly, but just remember one thing - number of post counts don't impress me. . No banned filter protection stops everybody everytime. Software is not that good. That's why when we know the member's name from another forum, we watch them a long time - if we suspect we will start seeing little DIGS in a forum we're not even posting in! Not following you here very we'll/
Please chill though on who and why someone is banned, this isn't another forum where we DEBATE the banning of a member over a 18 page post. Members here can show their own words which hung them, they do not need my help. I agree there may be a touch of drooling over a member who has MORE than asked for it DOES get a bit of Chewing on - it happened recently, but is NOT the norm.
But I know when someone is genuine about staying and becoming an outstanding member here or when someone is detoxing on other forum's more open attitude toward the Wild Wild West style. I don't allow that here, our moderators and members don't allow that here. When you see someone written off as an Ahole, it is not done covertly, we LEAVE the posts when ever possible so a new member, or return member with little patiences gets exposed quickly and they just make fools of themselves.
Not sure which member I banned that seems to disturb you, but I am sorry. When someone makes it a point to open the EXIT DOOR in the forum, it is MY JOB to see they are escorted to thru the door and it is locked behind them. I deleted a whole paragraph just now, better to just again ask, WTH 1of16 - write me in PM if you have an issue. You do know I hope that NOT everyone with an issue is ridiculed than banned, not always and rarely enjoyable.
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And stay away from the brown acid......... I hear it's s**t! :mrgreen:
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And stay away from the brown acid......... I hear it's s**t! :mrgreen:
:? :? :? :idunno:
...JP
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And stay away from the brown acid......... I hear it's s**t! :mrgreen:
:? :? :? :idunno:
...JP
Come on JP its a woodstock reference
;) ;)
Keith
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And stay away from the brown acid......... I hear it's s**t! :mrgreen:
:? :? :? :idunno:
...JP
Come on JP its a woodstock reference
;) ;)
Keith
Woodstock :? :? :? :idunno:
;)
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All,
My sincere apologies. Maybe I read a lot more into this than was actually there. I see that I was very very far off. This is a perfect case of "Judge NOT, lest YE be judged." When I look back over the assumptions that I made over what was being said in this and the other thread, I'm uncomfortable with myself.
Very sorry folks.
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Woodstock. You know. That book by Sir Walter Scot...
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don't you have to be over 60 to know what woodstock was ?
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I myself do not see a problem if he sells that cheap. This summer I made the farmers market every Saturday and developed a good customer base that began to return on a regular basis. I was selling 1/2lb for $2.50, 1lb for $4, and 2lb for $8. About 1/2 way through the summer there was another beekeeper show up for 3 or 4 weeks in a row. She was selling her honey for about half of what I was. She was asking something like $2.50 a lb for hers. After a few weeks she came over after the market closed and said she noticed I had several customers and that she hardly had any. I assumedshe was priced higher, once I discovered she was so cheap it only proved that if you stick to your guns and develop that beekeeper and customer basis they will buy your honey.
Its no diff than if one gas station was selling gas for $1.95 and the one across the street was selling gas for $1.30. Would you scold and crucify the cheaper station? No most everyone if not everyone would love the cheaper station. Whats the difference in gas and honey other than you are the one charging more. You always have to remember there are two sides to each coin.
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Sounds like you were selling good honey at a reasonable price. Customers are pretty loyal once they find something they trust.
Now there's some here with the theory that if another beekeeper set up beside you with $8 a pound honey all your customers would flock to them because your "cheap" honey must be inferior. ;)
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I myself do not see a problem if he sells that cheap. This summer I made the farmers market every Saturday and developed a good customer base that began to return on a regular basis. I was selling 1/2lb for $2.50, alb for $4, and alb for $8. About 1/2 way through the summer there was another beekeeper show up for 3 or 4 weeks in a row. She was selling her honey for about half of what I was. She was asking something like $2.50 a lb. for hers. After a few weeks she came over after the market closed and said she noticed I had several customers and that she hardly had any. I assumed-she was priced higher, once I discovered she was so cheap it only proved that if you stick to your guns and develop that beekeeper and customer basis they will buy your honey.
Its no diff than if one gas station was selling gas for $1.95 and the one across the street was selling gas for $1.30. Would you scold and crucify the cheaper station? No most everyone if not everyone would love the cheaper station. Whats the difference in gas and honey other than you are the one charging more. You always have to remember there are two sides to each coin.
well if you set up a observation hive at the gas station selling gas for $1.95 Ill bet you get back the customers you lost to the $1.30 station :lol:--perceived value is important -sometime try switching labels around -same honey different label -they will follow the label not the taste of the honey-RDY-B
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TOTALLY OF TOPIC - CaptainCunuck I ask you to PLEASE add your location in your profile, everyone does. It is of great help to know in what type climate you raise bees. Thank you. Enjoy the forum and please read the first post on this forum http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/board,97.0.html which is our bylaws.
You can surely debate your positive sides and the obvious downsides of apposing parties (in any issue) are yours to pick at. But may I suggest, according to the concenseus of my PMing - you should put a rev limiter on your message a little - you have 10 posts, do't come out of the gate too strong, devop a charactor if you must - but constrain your compassion to word of positive meaning and let the other side do the same - feel free to disagree - when you need to Stigmata yourself to post how deeply you feel, first you are way to "intouch" with your feminine side of your body - You need to make sese, not insult and don't judge others here. I will say this in a clear line. Represent your own opinion, do not negatively attack a persons way of thinking directly - always explain an issue positively that counters the bad in your opponents views.
Just get introduced like a new charactor into a soap opera and everyone is happy - become some one befoee you Fillabuster a topic. This is something all new members should think about - many people here have conversed in text, pms, audio and video chat and recorded to MP3 to play as an example of what Ventrillo sounds lie - a GREAT ! HOUR AUDIO TAPE - soon available for free download to stream player of all sorts in quality mp3 format.
When CABIN FEVER HITS and you feel like a lone igglo in the fridged air with nothing to eat but fat over a dying fire and the wood has blown away and is covered. Soon it will be cold and only remain a constant 45 degrees, more that enough to sleep the night in comfort with proper gear.
We all need to make these stories last a little longer, thinking out in clear messages that arrent to OFFENSIVE to some - just keeping it realy, you are revved up there by the members as an 8.5 out of 10 - that as a Administrator alarms me. It is like a bell going off in a Los Vegas hotel security booth. You ake a public spectical of yourself rathere than comply and give it 30 posts to wein in, not 10 to rush a point. That's all I'm saying. Welcome to the forums.
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With all due respect (and I did say with all due respect),that was one crazy, rambling, poorly spelled, disjointed post Beemaster. Just a little free advice, don't hit the crack pipe before you log on to the puter'.
God Bless (I've just offended people who don't beleve in God :roll:)
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I'm sorry Captain, but I suffer from seizure disorder - epilepsy of the frontal lobe. I have both short term memory, offactory and uncontrollable anxiety ALL brought on by Lymes Disease in 2001 which took a short cut to my brain, put me in a hospital, traveled my centralnervous system and burned my brain in the front. I try very hard to do this typing and it is becoming difficult. This typing in 1 years time has become laborous, and it is something I love with a passion.
I'm sorry I spent three months getting daily antibiotic shots to stay alive when the virus infected the blood brain barrier.
I have "memory" and now "typing issues" I have seen this developed over 2 weeks time - I see my neurologist this coming week - I take Seizure medication 2 times daily and I am healthy with some handicaps.
Captain: Many forums would allow me to say SCREW YOU as a reply to the crackpipe part, but we don't do that here, we treat you with respect, that is all we want from you. Instead you stuck a crackpipe in my mouth and lit it so I could post a post that looked okay to my damaged brain - sorry if it freakin bothers you in any way.
You get a warning for that, because I am tolerant of savages entering from the jungles. You really need to come in here with your shoes off and take her down a BIG NOTCH. You obviously posted that last message to get banned, no one wants you banned they want you to behave, that is totally different and you have one chance to behave.
Members.... I ask you is this FAIR????
Why couldn't you chill.
There will be no more warnings, behave in here or you will go away from Beemaster Family Friendly Forums - you are just having wiithdraw from other forums that all, we have support groups here to help you - it will be over soon, hang in there it gets much better very quickly.
P.S. Ask anyone here, I'm dropping the soap to you this time, use it wisely and join our place where you end by agreeing to disagree and not carry hatred because someone else's pont of views differ from yours. What is so hard to understand. I have admited to all of you I am brain damaged and I ask for your patiences reading some posts. But I don't lack the power to lead this pathetic member out the Forum Door - but he has the golden ticket, a free pass to be a good member, let's see what he does with it - you all know it is a very magical gift. I hope he can change, they are like Vampires, they want to change but many just can't. It's sad.
All Moderators - be fair but strong, you have full control of this stupid issue of a man who can not play like a good little boy. So you are marked,being nice keeps you here active to post freely and curtestly to all as if you knew everyone in this village personally. That's what we do here. I'm not looking for Mayberry, I just want a safe block for our kids to play and a joyous experience for the adult members, not one of conflict and negative posts.
Why on Earth am I explaining any of this to you - I think it is more for the members. I can think of at least two who cried reading this. You ain't hot pooh here, your a new guy, act like one and meet people with THOUSANDS of years combine experience who have talked for nearly 6 years in this forum - they are good friends, if not almost family. Don't think your gonna sell your CRAP VACCUUM by throwing dirt on our floors.
LASTLY, it is up to you. IF you fail learning to be FREINDS with the members quickly, then you are a sharing member, if you pop your words out to rib someone they better accept it as humor or kindness and THAT is what it should have been intended by you.
If I were a betting man, I'd say you couldn't do it - hang here 48 hours without making an Ahole of yourself. Please prove me wrong.
ANY INPUT APPRICIATED MEMBERS. BACK ME UP IF YOU BELIEVE I AM RIGHT. TELL ME WHAT YOU WOULD DO. BE CONSTRUCTIVE, but these guys, using this language wants to know why their membershp is in jeopardy - dud?
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Actually I'm a woman. That might explain why "I'm too in touch with my feminine side" (an incredibly offensive, sexist comment that I suppose is the fault of the lymes disease) . With a masters degree in psychology I'm very familiar with the concept of conforming to the group. It makes people feel safe,accepted,like they belong, unfortunately it doesn't foster growth.
Your site needs an "unregister" option
God Bless
To respond to your ever growing post, it's my opinion that the reason you didn't ban me was because you wouldn't have had an excuse to contribute all that nonsense.
I was going to quote your more colorful insults, but I see that they have been removed. I realize that speaking to someone in that manner probably is an attempt on your part to feel "whole".
I'll pray for your soul.
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God Bless (I've just offended people who don't beleve in God :roll:)
I'm not a Christian (assuming that's the religion you refer to) and I'm not offended. What I am a little bit offended by...just a little bit, is people who claim to be Christians and then to do something nasty like shoot out an insult like you did. That might be something to jokingly say in familiar company, but you don't know him or anybody else here for that matter. I think Jesus said "Love thy neighbor as thyself." Sage advice which as a "non-believer" I work hard to live by just the same. If you're going to toss around your membership then maybe that's one to consider.
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don't you have to be over 60 to know what woodstock was ?
No I was talking about the one they did in the late 90's ;)
Keith
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With all due respect (and I did say with all due respect),that was one crazy, rambling, poorly spelled, disjointed post Beemaster. Just a little free advice, don't hit the crack pipe before you log on to the puter'.
God Bless (I've just offended people who don't beleve in God :roll:)
Just my opinion,but it looks like a guest in your home tried to spit in your face. Just my opinion,but if thats the gratitude you get for allowing them to be a member,I would have to think twice about their intentions here. The intentions do not seem to be of good nature.
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We do have a SELF DELE ACCOUNT BUTTON in the profile section at the botton left - I'll make sure it is turned on and PLEASE use the door to go away. If you don't leave on your own, tonight you are banned anyway.
Captain, I just accidentally erased a page I wasted righting you. First I think you are freaking sick enjoying humor concerning someone Brain Disease or any ailment, 25 years ago, intollerent scum laughed at my brother in his wheelchair - he had sever cerebral palsy, in exchange firend took it upon themselves to let the dirtbag see what it was like to not havr your hands and feet working for a few months - I bet he grew a great deal of respect from his lesson. I didn't know thatfriends of my brother and mine showed an arrogant and intollerant low life that HEALTH is a blessing, not something you can laugh at when someone else suffers and you don't
That make you dog crap in my book. We have officers who nearly gave their lives to protect citizens in our forum, you'd probably chuckle along even more at their constant struggles. You are selfish and revolting - my stomach turns thinking of people that you conjure up in my mind. I won't waste another post writing you.
You will be banned for repeated bad mouthing a member of the forum, you couldn't even take 30 seconds and add your location to your profile - you are not a team player, so go play with yourself. Enough is enough, I'll give you today to say happy good byes, but I don't think you made any friends here, have you? But by midnight tonight EST you will be banned.
NO ONE MAKES FUN OF ANY ONE'S HANDICAPS and stays here - I almost died because of neurological lymes and you find it laughable that I work hard trying to communicate when my ability to type has lessened greatly from a brain disease - you sick twisted human.
Bet your a blast around handicapped kids too - as a group, we hate the intolerance of people who walk in and act the way you act. You are pathetic to me, I feel sad for you in a tiny way, but then I recall your words and any teared eye I could work up a tear with dries right out.
midnight tonight you are gone - enjoy your last day. Don't behave and you will be banned the minute you go overboard. If you had no intention to be a member in good standing, why on Earth did you come here? Most people who act like you have agendas before coming here - but most are smart enough to make past our trial period, we've watched every post of yours and could tell days ago, you just can't hack it here.
TO THE MEMBERS - you only need to read this post or the 12 or so from this Captain what's her face and there will be no further explanation needed. Have a Good Day. At least most of the Trouble walking through the door is not good at being stealth - they all jump the gun andruin any chance of even pretending to fit it.
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Can I say something?
It seems that a good bit of this argument was held outside of our view. The sad thing is I thought all of it should have been. I have noticed lately we seem to ban someone pretty regular; it is almost a weekly occurrence. I think a lot of things are said in PM then a rebuttal is added to the thread for all to see. That is not fair to the guy just reading through the thread, we miss the whole argument then form opinions with out all the facts, making for poor opinions. Reading through this thread how it got to the point where people are being told sc**w you and to smoke a crack pipe, I can't make the connection post to post. Reading through the post you realize, as a reader, something is missing from the post.
Is this the cabin fever all joked would come? If so I think it is a shame. As long as a new member comes in and does not offend with poor language or some of the other immoral things beemaster and others has created this forum to be with out, and against, I don't see a problem with the fact their points of view are different. I notice some of the new people (who are now banned) had some views vary different then me, but I enjoyed discussing their views politely on the forums. I noticed it seemed ( to me ) they only became belligerent when we ganged up on them with threats of banishment and the such, again just my opinion with only half the argument’s facts. I think we should maybe allow a bit more latitude with some of the new guys (as long as no bylaws are broken). I think this might make for a more rounded environment for the forums. We have so many different opinions on how to treat our bees, and in the case of this thread sell honey, how can you hope to not have a wide array of opinions on truly complicated matters such as the Israel/hamas war? We will disagree I think it makes for a better place. If every time I wrote something, I also got ten people saying yep I agree I believe I would go somewhere else, I would have to. What would I have here to learn? It is through thought that we learn and become better.
Just my thoughts I might be wrong but at least someone will think about it.
Keith
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For what it's worth Keith, there were no pm's going on between me and anyone else. Everything I've written is on the forum for all to see. Not sure what prompted Beemaster to admonish me for being insulting, or for that matter being too in touch with my feminine self :?, or that I should turn down my "revv's, but clearly he overestimates the value of being a member of this forum.
It's pretty clear to me that he has some remorse over his unsolicitated attack, but his ego will not allow him to extract himself from the situation.
I've counselled many people over the years with life alteing illnesses, the most difficult hurdle to overcome is for them to not use it as an excuse for their personality flaws.
When a person lowers themselves by switching the subject to their own personal problems or rambling on about "someone they know who went through this or that in their life", my training has taught me not to fuel their fire of self pity.
God Bless........ and "Go Leafs :-D"
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Hey Captain are you ever going to tell us your location?
...JP
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captain, you could have had good discussions here, and even arguments. no one here can be accused of engaging in "group think" on bees or other subjects. with a few exceptions and the occasional regrettable loss of temper, we do try to show respect for others and their ideas. sometimes we just agree to disagree. you chose to engage in personal attacks on people you know nothing about, and with whom you chose not to take the time to get to know.
this argument over price is like the guy who started emailing me pitching a bleep about me not charging for cutouts and swarm catching. he accused me of going about scooping up low hanging swarms and leaving the hard stuff (for which he charged) to serious beekeepers like himself.
if i can afford to undercut your price and still make the profit that I feel i need to make, that's my business. undercutting competitors is good and smart business as long as you are not damaging your own business.
giving away your product is your own business.
if your competitors are getting angry about your business practices, you are probably doing something right!
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Captain:
Wasn't it you who explained my rambling post? I try nd explain to you a health issue which has incompasitated me at my favorite craft: writing. It is a struggle. But I'm not making excuses for anything I've said. You are rude, crude and not going to be a member here after midnight tonight. I tried to explain something you haven't been around long enough to know anything about and you write it off as a pathetic excuse on my end. You are truly a sad individual.
I ask of Keith and any member who sees what little it can take to get booted here, to understand it is their own actions that get them to that point, and of course as a REGULAR MEMBER you do not have the tracking software and data that we do whih informs us that someone is likely a plant setting up the next round of forum terrorism.
I enjoy doing corrective measures in PM but when people make a fool of themselves in public, then calling them out in public works fine for me. If you call me a crack smoking misfit or other term, should I do what? I leave their comments for all to see and show that "when applied to circumstances" our rules work quite well.
This of course wouldn't apply to our seniored members, they have earned respect and "get what we do here" people like Captain runs in, can't even post her location and then stirs crap with a broom handle and we are supposed to take it - no way.
Captain, you come in, can't play by the rules and then think making me look bad with CRACKPIPE remarks etc., but trust me, you lost your membership that day. And it wouldn't matter who it was written to - I tend to be thicker skinned when such things are addressed to me, if it were a productive member you pulled a line like that on, you would have been gone THAT MINUTE.
So, the last two weeks 3 people with similar agendas have worked their way out the door - two of them for the second time and another who was here to stir crap and failed miserably. I am stating for the record to the membership - their is a small group of "other beekeeping forum members at a rather low ranked site" who thinks that enough head-games with us will raise them in their standings. They recast the same half a dozen members in here under different IDs and after a week or two they go over the top doing what they intended to do - make Beemaster Forums look like the bad guys.
If people would rather just see the windows and doors left open and see what flys stroll in and what maggots fester in the trash, we could run their game their way. Instead, if I get a little combative with a third time offender or someone with no intention of sticking around, only making what few days they have here miserable - the Captain has bought some time and is winding down.
But if you think that I feel REMORSE for anything I've aid to you - you are not correct. I ask you to calm your jets, you tell me to put down the crack pipe. Let me explain this Captain - you have no rights here, you haven't even earned priviledges in our group. Your only reason for still being here is to get more wasted typing out of me, so that too will end now.
----------------- MEMBER INSIGHT -----------------
The new people coming and then getting booted are a WAVE of people, many from a place OTHER THAN BEESOURCE (so please no rumors there) and this flock of new members are here to cause havoc - I choose to call them on it, rather than hide this behind the scenes. It is not your average new member, there is a possee in town and they've spread out and are coming in at different times to appear that turmoil exists.
No this isn''t Cabin Fever", that is when people just get grumpy fro months of not doing anything much with their bees - This is a handful of people we need to deal with - the best they can hope for is US to boot a ton of what appears all new people so it appears we have issues, all we are doing is taking out the trash and freshening the air here - it is NOT as big of a deal as you may think. We have slugs making their way back in again and again, so we need to poor salt on the slugs. It is almost over, the slugs are retreating to the pile they crawled from.
Just cause someone says they are new, doesn't mean this isn't their third time here but they have new credentials which allow them through the filters. These are our main concerns, real new members with issues, if they feel the need to go, I'm more than willing to show them the door.
I wish I could tell everyone Everything - you need to trust that behind the scenes LOTS go on here. Keeping it civil for the members is a full time job sometimes and other times weeks go by with no troubles.
I'll reword this if need be, back on soon.
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Hey Captain are you ever going to tell us your location?
...JP
I think she did...."Go leafs"... ;)
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Actually I'm a woman. That might explain why "I'm too in touch with my feminine side" (an incredibly offensive, sexist comment that I suppose is the fault of the lymes disease) . With a masters degree in psychology I'm very familiar with the concept of conforming to the group. It makes people feel safe,accepted,like they belong, unfortunately it doesn't foster growth.
Your site needs an "unregister" option
God Bless
To respond to your ever growing post, it's my opinion that the reason you didn't ban me was because you wouldn't have had an excuse to contribute all that nonsense.
I was going to quote your more colorful insults, but I see that they have been removed. I realize that speaking to someone in that manner probably is an attempt on your part to feel "whole".
I'll pray for your soul.
Wow. Just, wow. My husband told me about this thread and I have to say, I am amazed at the total and complete lack of human compassion you've shown here. Don't let the door hit you on the butt on the way out. Then again, methinks you're nothing but a (http://annzoid.com/images/smileys/smiley_troll.gif)
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Your post was "rambling" because you were telling me not to insult people, something about "revving it down" and something about being too close to my feminine side.
Well, my posts are there for all to see. There are no insults, no arguments, no "revved up" comments, and as a woman I can't help but to be feminine.
It was you that tried to spin that as an attack on your diminished mental capacity, which I could not possiby have any knowledge of.
You seem to be implying that I have arrived from some other forum. That is a false assumption on your part.
But, I will give you credit for making me laugh. You claim that you want to have a family friendly forum, and yet your posts contain the most vulgar,base and disgusting comments that I have seen here. I guess it's not my place to tell you how to raise your family, but I wouldn't want children reading that nonsense and thinking that is the way an adult should communicate.
I will pray that you find peace.
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yet your posts contain the most vulgar,base and disgusting comments
just to satisfy my curious side....could you reference some of these comments?
and as a woman I can't help but to be feminine.
there is a difference between being female and being feminine.
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time to lock this thread-up. No good can come from this at this point. On the bright side, bees were flying today and I got stung. Felt like an old shoe.....
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:-( i was just winding up!! :chop: that's no fun :evil:
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:-( i was just winding up!! :chop: that's no fun :evil:
Its almost 5PM here, I guess I am feeling a TGIF moment and being "mellow" ! :-P
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:-( i was just winding up!! :chop: that's no fun :evil:
Its almost 5PM here, I guess I am feeling a TGIF moment and being "mellow" ! :-P
Couldn't agree more! Buh bye! :locked:
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As a new member here, I'm fairly appalled by where this thread has gone. I'd expound on my opinions but I'm afraid I'd get banned. :(
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Need to lock this thread nothing good from here on
Keith