Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum
BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => HONEYBEE REMOVAL => Topic started by: beecanbee on September 02, 2009, 04:18:32 pm
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With mellifera, can you tell if a queen is in the swarm by the looks of the clump? With cerana, if the swarm is roughly symmetrical in shape and teardrop in appearance, you have a queen. If there is no queen, the swarm will be oddly shaped, possibly elongated, or with ribs, etc. Does swarm shape tell you anything about a mellifera swarm?
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With mellifera, can you tell if a queen is in the swarm by the looks of the clump? With cerana, if the swarm is roughly symmetrical in shape and teardrop in appearance, you have a queen. If there is no queen, the swarm will be oddly shaped, possibly elongated, or with ribs, etc. Does swarm shape tell you anything about a mellifera swarm?
Why would they swarm without a queen? To reduce the population of the parent hive by commiting mass suicide?
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i don't know that i have ever found one without a queen, but i sure have found them with virgin queens, and they don't always make it. i have found that those swarms with virgins have a much higher number of drones with them.
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Why would they swarm without a queen?
Cerana frequently abscond without the queen. If the queen died and wax moths took over - they abscond and gather into what may look like a swarm, but an ill-shapen one and of no value. If I upset them thru inspection or harvesting they may swarm (with the queen, along with nurse bees staying behind) - but the clump will be ill-shapen. However, if it is nicely shaped - I must try to recapture them, since it contains the queen. If ill-shapen, I don't bother.
The question.... with mellifera can you tell anything about the queen from the appearance of the swarm?
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i don't know that i have ever found one without a queen
Maybe this is the answer to my question... if mellifera generally do not abscond... Maybe any swarm you come across can be assumed to be queen-right?
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It sounds to me like two different behavior patterns from two different races of bee. As far as I know millifeera will not swarm/abscond because they are queenless. They will abscond if conditions are poor, but I dont think they will without a queen. A hive does sound different when queen-less though.
Maybe someone else knows different.
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beecanbee
How do you house your bees? Do you use langstroth or similar hives or something completely different.
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beecanbee
How do you house your bees? Do you use langstroth or similar hives or something completely different.
I am using Langs for the mellifera - but upright boxes (known as AYs) for the cerana. The AY is like a Lang brood box stood on its side - that is, tall and narrow, ten frame.
I have not yet encountered a mellifera swarm - hence my questions, as I was basing it against my experience with cerana. I think as bee-nuts said - two different behaviour patters. Hence I am unlikely to encounter a queenless mellifera swarm (but do so regularly with cerana).