My first gum removal--HELP!

[ArmucheeBee]

I did my first gum removal tonight.  I had planned to bring it home and leave the bees in the gum all winter and then remove them into a top-bar hive in early spring.  Here is the problem:  the trunk must have came crashing down and dislodged most of the comb.  The bees are clinging to the inside walls and of course climbing all over the comb in the bottom.  2. Years of dead bees are in the log because it was vertical on the tree and they fell to the bottom  3. It is full of dead bees, honey leaking, and maggots (or maybe SHB larvae).  Both ends are open 8 inches and 13 inches- now screened over.  One branch is screened over about 6 inches.  The bee hole is about 3x3 inches and I took the screen off so they can come and go in the morning.  The log is home laying on its side with the bee hole at 9 o'clock facing east.
Should I get these bees out now?  I can make a top bar in a few minutes (aka M. Bush).  But I have another removal in the morning, so there goes my morning time.  This log is beautiful and would make some really nice old time gum hives-12 inches across inside.  Should I lock them in so they will not swarm to get away from all the maggots?  Help?  PS; I did not cut this tree down, it was cut maybe 3 days ago and has been laying on its side in Cave Spring, GA. 

[ArmucheeBee]

Here are some more:

[hankdog1]

If it was me i would try to get them out of there ASAP.  I'm sure they are stressed by everything and the quicker you can help to make things normal for them the better.  It would have been better to of waited until next spring to have done this too as it wouldn't have been so heavey with stores of honey.  But i know sometimes you can't wait. 

[Bill W.]

Yep, sounds like you need to get them out immediately.  Having the orientation changed has probably really screwed up the combs and caused all the nectar to leak out.  If it has been three days, you're lucky they haven't already absconded.  I've never heard of maggots in a bee hive, so I don't think you're getting off that easy.  With SHB and a messed up hive, you're going to have a challenge.

It might not be a bad idea to cage the queen if you can find her, shake all the bees into a new hive, and leave the combs.

[JP]

Don't know the outcome by now but in a jam you could just put some kind of bait hive next to the tree, hopefully the queen is alive and she will enter the bait hive along with the rest if them.


...JP

[BenC]

Get them out now, the maggots and other debris (pestilence magnet) will only make it hard on them.  Waiting for them to rebuild a nest will only make the later removal harder on you.  Should be a relatively simple removal at this point if you can find the time.  Salvage combs if you think it's worthwhile, but if the maggots (SHB?) and debris are as bad as it sounds I'd just burn the leftovers to kill those future hive invaders.  It'll be alot easier to gauge how many survivors you have and what to do with them once they are in a box

[johnnybigfish]

 Do you think the maggots could be bee  larvas?
your friend,
john

[JP]

Do you think the maggots could be bee  larvas?
your friend,
john

John, the larvae are most likely shb or waxmoth, when a tree falls and combs smoosh against each other there is lots of death in that colony, if they are lucky the colony can abscond with the queen in persuit, but without the queen and ability to make a new one, they are doomed.


...JP

[ArmucheeBee]

OK.  Here's is where I am at this afternoon after 14 hours of beeking.  I had to cone the house this morning instead of a cutout which gave me time to make a new bottom and top for the gum hive.  I now have the deep placed in front of the gum and have coned the hole.  I tried to remove what I could from the gum.  Every bit of comb was collasped, coated in honey and maggots(1000's and 1000's) too many in my opinion to be SHB and moth.  Looks like some bot fly and other fly larvae.  I bagged some but just left the rest and started smoking the hive.  Allowed the hangers-on inside to exit then closed it back up.  A friend brought me a new queen on a frame cage with attendants.  I also stole 2 frames of honey from my other hive and put all this in the box with some new frames.  The bees were returning to the gum and going in the deep at 8pm.  Who knows how many are left.  No sign of the gum queen.  The combs were crushed together so I don't see how she survived.  There were 100's of dead bees in between the combs that I raked out.

How long should I let this queen stay in the cage?

Should I try to keep a very, small colony?  Could I just feed them all fall and winter and see what this donated queen can do this spring? 

On another note my 1st hive are drawing out the MannLake 105 plastic very well.  I like that plastic.  My first generation is due on Aug. 21.

Thank You for all the replies.  It got me going and monday I will dispose of the gum and maggots.

[JP]

I would keep things compact but hard to give advice cause I don't know how many you have in the deep now, but my gut tells me a nuc would probably be the way to go.

Place the queen atop the set up and see how they respond to her, if they are trying to tend to her you can more than likely direct release her, if biting at her which I don't thing they'll do, wait a day or two, but they have probably been queenless for several days now because of the entire event.


...JP

[ArmucheeBee]

This is the final installment of the gum hive.  The bees are in the deep with their new queen out and in good spirits.  Only a few hundred bees however.  We pulled the gum log to the edge of the lake and burned it out with gasoline.  Throw several pounds of comb and millions of maggots into the lake to feed the fish--recycling.  So I will watch this little hive and may build a nuc for them this winter.  Thanks for all the help.