Welcome, Guest

Author Topic: Who makes 54kg/hive?  (Read 11892 times)

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Who makes 54kg/hive?
« on: March 19, 2014, 07:14:05 am »
We'd be lucky to make 10kg/hive/year here.  We have 14 hives at the moment, but I can't imagine exceeding 600kg per year and having to pay a honey levy.

Most aussies will have received the voting info about whether to increase the levy and also the level of honey production at which the levy is payable.  I'm interested to hear opinions although I don't think I should vote as I don't pay the levy.

Doubling the levy will obviously affect the professionals who make a living out of the stuff rather than us backyarders.  Will it mean the packers will lower their already scanty price?  Will local honey go up on the shelves and encourage more importation of cheap honey?  Will beekeepers lose money and find it hard to keep the operation going?  It's only a few cents...maybe the impact will be minimal?

I had actually not heard about this levy before.  Could anyone who pays it please describe what records they keep and how it is paid?

Lone

Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2014, 08:22:50 am »
34kg since Christmas - no paperwork to prove it :roll:
David L

Offline Geoff

  • Heavenly Beekeeper
  • Field Bee
  • ********
  • Posts: 918
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2014, 06:13:38 pm »
      Levy the imports    !!!!!
Local Area Network in Australia - the LAN down under.

Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2014, 06:40:25 pm »
      Levy the imports    !!!!!

Agree
David L

Offline Suncat

  • New Bee
  • *
  • Posts: 18
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2014, 07:51:01 pm »
I am new to beekeeping, inheriting from dad about 12 months ago (with very little experience, but nothing like on-the-job training).  I only have 2 hives active at the moment and hope to increase that to 4 or 5 next spring.

I have robbed 3 times in the last 12 months and each time I get about 35kg per hive.  Each hive has 2 supers on it and appear to be really active. I always leave about 4-6 frames of incomplete or uncapped honey each time.

SHB is giving me some stress, but I have modified the bottom boards to be a home made screened external trap (filled with Lime at the moment) and that seems to be helping.

I have been reading the forum for a couple of months now, and thought I should become more than a passive reader  :laugh:
John

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2014, 01:12:30 am »
Welcome, Suncat.  I live in a pretty dry area, so it has the benefit of fewer SHB problems but also less honey.  I don't go following flows, though.

Quote
Levy the imports    !!!!!
There's no reason on Earth that we should have to import honey at any time.  Surely we should be self-sufficient.  In a bad year there might be less on the shelf, but I've never known a lack of honey to kill anyone.  In a year of excess then save some for the poor years instead of exporting it all out.  Then some of the biosecurity issues the levy is meant to deal with will be solved  :)

Lone


Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2014, 02:00:44 am »
My understanding on imported honey is when a certain large commercial processor/packer who's name starts with a "C" offered a ridiculously low price for bulk honey from the apiaries they were told to go jump (sort of) the company then built processing plants in Argentina and China and sends the honey back to Australia to be packaged as local product " from local and imported honey"
David L

Offline 100 TD

  • New Bee
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2014, 07:50:31 am »
I spoke to a commercial guy a couple of years ago and he gets 200 kg per hive per year, he moves his hives, follows honey flows etc, plus he gets paid for pollination. I just leave them in the paddock and don't get a lot.
Back to the levy, is this a state or federal levy, I haven't received anything, I know NSW fees are going up and no compensation for AFB anymore.

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2014, 08:35:19 am »
It is national.

http://www.daff.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004/183379/information-honey-levy.pdf

The proposal is to double the levy to 4.6c/kg and make it payable at 1500kg instead of 600kg
http://honeybee.org.au/programs/honey-levy-reform-and-increase/

I am guessing that the voting information was only sent to those who recorded more than 11 hives on the last DPI return and voting only available to the same.

The Australian Honey Bee Industry Council is not exactly part of DPI/DAFF, but I find it odd that we did not receive information on the levy when we first registered. 

Lone

Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2014, 06:24:16 pm »
What is evident is that if you sell all your production to the public yourself you don't pay the levy until you reach 600/1500kg in the year. However if you sell any of your honey, regardless of the quantity, to a processor (primary purchaser ) you will be paying the level indirectly as it will be allowed for in the price you will be paid as the processor pays the level on all the honey they buy.

It is the number of hives you have registered that will flag you for attention with regard to levy payment. I understand the DPI says the average production per hive is 75kg - this is an average based on number of hives registered and honey produced. It is lower than actual as the figure is skewed by the large commercial apiaries for a number of reasons. - they may not have all their hives deployed all year round, they may be pollinating crops and not getting any production of honey, they may loose large number of hives to poison spraying in the area just to mention a few.
David L

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2014, 08:30:37 pm »
Quote
I understand the DPI says the average production per hive is 75kg

The Honey Bee Industry Council says 54kg/hive.  Government departments can work in the same building and disagree. I don't know what data they use to work out the average.

I extract from all my hives but based on those figures I would have to extract all 10 frames twice a year, and it's not happened yet that there have been two flows in a year good enough to have all the honey capped.  54 and 75 seem like high figures to me but they might be a small amount to some people.  I think paying the levy must be based on honesty for the market/roadside stall sellers.

Lone


Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2014, 08:42:46 am »
Lone I just pulled another 12kg making 57kg in three months from one hive and this is on half frames. What is the vegetation in your area? do you know what is flowing when? How many supers are you running? The core message of the course I did was maximising your honey production by maximising your bees. One hive of 60000 bees will produce more honey than 2 hives of 30000. Run 3 supers only - bottom brood, top two for honey - under super by moving honey frames to the top box and putting empty frames in the middle box - bees wont climb over full frames to deposit honey higher up in the top box move full uncapped frames to the outside. The bonus is that with the bee activity in the top of the hive the SHB has nowhere to go and is hounded out. keep pulling out full frames from the top moving partial frames up from the middle and put stickies back in the middle. That keeps the bees busy and stimulates the queen to keep laying. More workers more honey. Move honey and pollen out of the brood box and up to the honey supers, give the queen room by moving capped brood to the outside and putting empty brood frames in the middle for the queen to fill with eggs. a frame can hold 3000 brood each maximise the number of bees and you maximise your honey.

But then I'm only a newbee
David L

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2014, 09:52:44 am »
Thanks for the reply, wombat.  Most people around here run one deep honey super except the year there was a massive bloodwood flow.  Before the days of pests and disease the old-timers would often have double honey supers and leave them alone till they were filled, leaving brood comb for years till it was black.  But as my mentor says, one super is a lot easier to work. I usually put the frames I want finished first into the middle area, and turn them around if one side is capped and the other untouched.  I move brood frames up for various reasons occasionally, but not just to increase the amount of brood. I am finding the good brood hives are also not always the good honey hives.  I try to aim for moderately strong.  Especially this year, the hives are just booming and swarming.  It is hard to get a honey/brood balance.  Strong brood hives and a load of honey goes to rearing them.

When we did have the doubles on the good flow, it took months for the honey to be capped.  I tried both configurations, full on top or in middle, but I've seen that bees work either way.  Some have said they work from the bottom and some have said the top!  My conclusion is patience is more necessary than equipment.

I look all the time for what is out in the paddock. In the past 3-4 years there has not been a time when nothing was flowering.  But before that, I couldn't have more than a couple of hives at home and I was also feeding for a while because they were so weak with nothing in flower.  It was before the rules changed and I could keep hives in town. It is a bit harder to tell if there are flows in town, but the other beekeepers usually tell me if they are extracting, and hives will never starve there. 

I am pretty cautious about percentage of capped honey on the frame.  I know that in some areas you can basically extract when uncapped, but they say here 90% + is best.  I saw a beekeeper in USA extract and questioned it when most of the frames were uncapped.  He called it off after testing with a refractometer.  That is more accurate than the dripping nectar test.  I don't like fermented honey!

I guess I could make more honey if we had the time to chase flowers.  But that would make it a full time job and there is a grazing property to look after here as well as my real work.  Lifting hives is too heavy for us to do all the time, and we can't drive hundreds of kilometers and monitor the hives as well.  I think you are probably in a more suitable honey area.  We have also run out of equipment.  It's so hard..!  :(

Going back to the levy, I haven't read all the documents, but it does seem to say it's payable for honey production at 600kg..  I wonder if you pay it do you have to include the honey given away?  We probably give away nearly as much as is sold.

I am still a learner, every time I see them.

Lone


Offline kanga

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 134
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2014, 10:14:18 am »
"I haven't read all the documents, but it does seem to say it's payable for honey production at 600kg..  I wonder if you pay it do you have to include the honey given away?"

Lone, it is on honey sales not on production:

"Australian honey producer levies are set at 2.3c/kg for annual honey sales greater than 600kg."

Kevin

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #14 on: March 24, 2014, 10:33:58 am »
Thanks Kevin!

It wasn't very clear in the DPI document.  "Levy is payable on honey produced in Australia, and on honey produced in Australia and used in the production of other goods."

Do you pay the levy or have information about it?

Lone

Offline kanga

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 134
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #15 on: March 24, 2014, 10:02:56 pm »
Thanks Kevin!

It wasn't very clear in the DPI document.  "Levy is payable on honey produced in Australia, and on honey produced in Australia and used in the production of other goods."

Do you pay the levy or have information about it?

Lone


No I currently do not produce enough honey to pay the levy.

The reason they are seeking to increase the amount to 1500kg is due to the costs incurred in collecting the levy which currently on 600kg it costs them more to collect it then what they receive.

Kevin

Offline Wombat2

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 404
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #16 on: March 24, 2014, 10:21:56 pm »
I've been told when you register more than 30 hives they will come looking for the levy
David L

Offline kanga

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 134
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2014, 04:28:01 am »
As per there FAQ:

"The simple reality is that research funded with the honey levy and managed by RIRDC has not been able to identify a cost effective or legal mechanism for collecting levy from very small producers including amateurs."

"Stage 2 of the proposed National Bee Biosecurity Program will focus on raising additional funds from hobby beekeepers, where the benefit from this separate source of funds will be spent directly on hobby beekeepers."

Offline CJ

  • House Bee
  • **
  • Posts: 59
  • Gender: Male
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2014, 06:30:44 am »
We had a bloody ripper of a year this year!! We harvested a smidge over 20kg per hive (2 hives) BUT; We also made 23 splits (now full 2 box hives), drew out over 360 frames and managed to get 1/2 - 2/3 full supers (8 frame deeps) over each hive for winter before we started feeding this month (top up/insurance policy)  :-D  :-D  :-D Cannot wait to see what next season brings!

Offline Lone

  • Queen Bee
  • ****
  • Posts: 1094
  • Gender: Female
Re: Who makes 54kg/hive?
« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2014, 08:46:56 am »
23 splits, CJ??

Kanga,  I guess there is no such thing as free honey.  I wonder how they propose to spend it ON hobby beekeepers.  Perhaps to raise more revenue from them?  I suppose the first thing will be to help fund our premier's 70 grand pay rise?

Lone

 

anything