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Author Topic: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences  (Read 8374 times)

Offline rayb

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Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« on: January 12, 2008, 10:58:15 pm »
For those of you planning on using pollen substitutes, which brand do you prefer?  My first year (last year) I bought simple soy substitute from Kelley Bees. After seeing the other more complex home made mixtures on this site and the commercial substitutes, soy seems too "simple".

Is soy alone going to do the job or will the others be a lot better?

Thanks, Ray

Offline SteveSC

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2008, 12:39:43 am »
Ray...

I used this recipe last year and I just made up a batch today.  According to ABC \ XYZ's recommended amino acid percentages for protein patties this recipe meets or exceeds all of them.  Last yr. I used it and the bees liked it - no problems at all.

Dry measurements:

2 lbs. Baker's yeast  ( Sam's sells it, about $11 )                                  = 1 quart
Goat or Calf milk replacer ( 24% protein - powdered. Farm supply store )  = 6 quarts ( you can buy by the pail )
White granulated sugar                                                                    = 10 lbs.

Mix dry ingredents.

Use 6 cups of well mixed dry ingredents to 5 oz. warm water. Mix completely until very stiff. The 6 cup portion will make 3 good size patties. Press each patty between wax paper.  Place one (1) wax paper patty on top of frames over brood area.  You'll probably have to use a shim\spacer ( I use 1 1\2" spacer )  between the patty and the inner cover in order for the patty not to be squeezed when you close to hive.

The entire recipe will make about 21 nice size ( 8" dia. X 3\8" ) patties.  You'll have about $20 to $25 dollars in the patties.  Good luck..



 




Offline metzelplex

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2008, 03:50:11 pm »
      I have used   bee-pro , feedbee, and that new mega bee that dadant just started carrying last year my bees seemed to like them all the bee-pro and feedbee  gave me a good buildup and as for the mega bee I'm going to put another patty in today and I'll see what kind of build up I have this spring you can buy them in small quantities but I always buy them in bulk  bee-pro comes in 50 lb bags feedbee in 44 lb bags and mega bee comes in 40 lbs bags Ill mix 5 gal. of  syrup I use hfcs (pro-sweet 50) because the patties don't seem to get rock hard like they do when I mix sugar and water I guess it's because its cooked and the sugar water isn't I don't know for sure but anyway I mix 5 gal. of syrup with 5 lbs of irradiated pollen mix it real well and let it sit for  an hour or so just to let it soak in some syrup then I mix in a bag of pollen substitute
it gets real thick real fast so I slowly add in small amounts 1 more gallon of syrup as I mix everything then I let it sit overnight .Thats 1 bag of mix ,5 lbs. of pollen and 6 gallons of syrup thats what I use   with bee-pro I make 123 patties that are roughly about a pound it cost me about .62 cents a patty , with feedbee I made 117 patties at .93 cents each and with mega bee I made 112 patties at.99 cents per patty I get all my stuff from Dadant and sons or Mann lake I live between them about 45 min from ea. I know everybody has their own mix and their own ideas but this is what works for me hope it helps   
                              metzelplex

Offline rayb

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2008, 04:57:37 pm »
Thanks Steve and Metzelplex,

Looks like if I'm going to go to the effort of putting patties on, then something better than just soy flour would be appropriate. I'm looking forward to giving them a good start.

Ray

Offline NWIN Beekeeper

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2008, 08:06:31 am »
[Is soy alone going to do the job or will the others be a lot better?]

I wouldn't suppose that people just put extra stuff in for no reason.

Look at what is being added, then try to figure out why that item is being added.

It takes a bit of studying bee nutrition to appreciate what and why.
When you do that you will have a much better appreciation (hate) for the generic term of "balanced diet".

Otherwise, you are chasing your tail asking everyone's opinion and getting a thousand answers.
You have to do what is appropriate for your area (demographics change what is appropriate to add).


There is nothing new under the sun. Only your perspective changes to see it anew.

Online Michael Bush

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2008, 08:17:46 am »
I have bought pollen from Mann Lake, Brushy Mt and collected it.  There's nothing as good as pollen.
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm  auf deutsche: bushfarms.com/de_bees.htm  em portugues:  bushfarms.com/pt_bees.htm
My book:  ThePracticalBeekeeper.com
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Offline Cindi

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2008, 10:07:33 am »
Metzelplex.  I see that you said that you said that you let the mixture stand overnight.  I am wondering how that works for you.  I say this because I remember when I did some research on making pollen patties, the site indicated that when making the pollen patties to immediately afterwards form the patties.  It had gone on to even tell the people (this must have been a commercial pollen patty maker) to not even wait until after lunch to form the patties because they will get too stiff.

I have always formed the patties immediately after mixing.  I think that I read in your posts that the pollen patties got really hard, unless I was misunderstanding what you said.  Wondering if you meant that the pollen mixture got really hard before you made the patties.  That would probably be because you let the mixture sit overnight.  I am not putting down your method, just trying to understand a little better.  Maybe I don't have to form the patties immediately, sometimes I am so pressed for time that to form the patties the next day would be more pertinent.  Interesting stuff.  Have a great, wonderful day.  Cindi
There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service

Offline tig

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2008, 07:54:10 pm »
i don't feed substitutes.  during the pollen season i trap some, dry it well and store a couple of kilos in the freezer just in case of a dearth period.  if i have to feed pollen, i take the frozen pollen, throw some into the blender with some confectionairs sugar and blend the two.  i spoon the mixture on the top bars as a dry feed and the bees polish it off within minutes.

Offline Cindi

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2008, 12:20:31 am »
Tig, I think your feeding is excellent and absolutely good.  Of course pollen and sugar are the best in the west.  I agree totally 100%.  BUT....where I live, it is not the best of weather when we are feeding the bees their pollen patties.  This is my opinion.  The pollen, mixed with brewers yeast and sugar and water make a firm product that can lay on top of the frames, it does not fall down to the bottom board (or through the screened bottom if one is using screened bottom boards that are open).  The bees go up to the top where it is warmer (if they aren't there already) and feed on it.

I think the purpose of the addition of brewers yeast is to act as the catalyst that holds the pollen together in one piece.

I am going to do an experiment this season.  I have said that I am an experimenter.  I know that the bees absolutely love the pollen patties that I make with the brewers yeast.  But I also would believe that it would be even more superior without the addition of the yeast.  I am going to indeed try to make a patty with only pollen and sugar.  Putting in the blender does sound like a good thing, but my blender is not very big (hee, hee).  I will be experimenting to see what happens without the brewers yeast.  I am totally open to all ideas, and hearing everyone's way of feeding pollen is absolutely wonderful. So much food for thought here.  Have a wonderful and best of days. Cindi
There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service

Offline Angi_H

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2008, 02:01:45 am »
      I have used   bee-pro , feedbee, and that new mega bee that dadant just started carrying last year my bees seemed to like them all the bee-pro and feedbee  gave me a good buildup and as for the mega bee I'm going to put another patty in today and I'll see what kind of build up I have this spring you can buy them in small quantities but I always buy them in bulk  bee-pro comes in 50 lb bags feedbee in 44 lb bags and mega bee comes in 40 lbs bags Ill mix 5 gal. of  syrup I use hfcs (pro-sweet 50) because the patties don't seem to get rock hard like they do when I mix sugar and water I guess it's because its cooked and the sugar water isn't I don't know for sure but anyway I mix 5 gal. of syrup with 5 lbs of irradiated pollen mix it real well and let it sit for  an hour or so just to let it soak in some syrup then I mix in a bag of pollen substitute
it gets real thick real fast so I slowly add in small amounts 1 more gallon of syrup as I mix everything then I let it sit overnight .Thats 1 bag of mix ,5 lbs. of pollen and 6 gallons of syrup thats what I use   with bee-pro I make 123 patties that are roughly about a pound it cost me about .62 cents a patty , with feedbee I made 117 patties at .93 cents each and with mega bee I made 112 patties at.99 cents per patty I get all my stuff from Dadant and sons or Mann lake I live between them about 45 min from ea. I know everybody has their own mix and their own ideas but this is what works for me hope it helps   
                              metzelplex



Where do you live Actually. Dadant is about 30 min from me an Mann Lake is about 1 hr from me. I live in Hanford Ca. Which is 30 min south of Fresno and 1 hr to hr and half from Bakersfield. It would bee :) nice to meet someone from my neck of the woods

Angi

Offline NWIN Beekeeper

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2008, 03:52:35 am »
[Dadant is about 30 min from me an Mann Lake is about 1 hr from me.]

If I lived that close to bee supply houses my operation would be run totally different.
-I'd also be totally broke, as I'd spend every last dime there too!

I don't think some folks realize just how fortunate they are sometimes.
If I order from Mann Lake in a pinch, I have to get my orders out of MN.
My shipping is often half the product price.

Dadant is almost the same case. Everyone claims fuel prices  :roll:
Perhaps I need to goto work and tell my boss I need to charge him an arrival fuel surcharge? :roll:

You'd be surprised how long a wish list you can run up over winter with hopes of buying everything at the big spring beekeeping meetings (where vendors usually will bring you product if ordered ahead of time).
There is nothing new under the sun. Only your perspective changes to see it anew.

Offline mudlakee

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2008, 07:30:26 am »
Yes where I live anything I want the shipping is almost half the cost and then add the taxes.  Tony

Offline tig

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2008, 08:43:55 am »
i can understand your concern about feeding the dry sugar/pollen mixture when the weather is bad.  when i have to feed a lot of colonies this mixture, i have the top feeder on and just pour it on the feeder, for that matter the same goes for the side feeders or even just on a small plate.  let me know how your concoction works.

Offline Cindi

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2008, 10:16:10 am »
Ha, speaking of that wish list, hee, hee.  I wish that one of my deep supers didn't have that warped side, it just doesn't fit together right.  I nailed it together and whole smackers!!!  Beautiful day in this great life.  Cindi
There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service

Offline Angi_H

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2008, 12:53:51 am »
What has saved my hide and allowed me to actually buy enough stuff for 2 hives was being that Dadant and Mann Lake is so close. So far I have not been to Mann Lake yet. But will be going there soon to buy some of the 15% Pollen Pattys with the pollen sub. With saving shipping and also picking up a few returns at half price I was able to get 2 hives for about 1 price. This is the only way I could have gotten 2 hives. And I will also be able to have a few extra med and shallow supers as an extra in case it is needed for a heavy flow year.

Angi

Offline rdy-b

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2008, 01:32:30 am »
Mann lake is about three and one half hours from hanford are you sure you are not going to one of the many warehouse dealers that cary some of the bulk items -and dose not mantain stock or has a show room-RDY-B

Offline Burl

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #16 on: January 19, 2008, 02:02:08 am »
Cindi , If you would like to post a picture of that super with the warped side , maybe one of us wood-techs could suggest a possible remedy.
  Beside some folks have hinted that I have a warped side , so I feel empathetic.
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Offline DennisB

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #17 on: January 19, 2008, 10:44:19 am »
This actually might have to go to a new post but, has anyone experienced an explosive growth of small hive beetle when you use a pollen patty? Last spring I put them in to 2 new hives and after about a week there was a lot of SHB all over them and the inner cover. It makes me a little nervous to do it again this year. Thanks

DennisB

Offline rdy-b

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2008, 01:56:46 pm »
thats a good point -lucky for many they have not goten established in california -migratory keepers get upset about the check pionts at pollination time but they are a serious threat -RDY-B

Offline Cindi

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Re: Pollen Patty Brand Preferences
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2008, 11:10:47 am »
Burl, I could do that, but I am unsure if there would be any remedy, period.  The warping is so slight, on one corner, it is actually hardly even noticeable, until you put on the lid, then it just doesn't fit very well.

I need several Imirie shims made for this season for feeding.  So my Husband said that he would cut the super down into several shims, so it is not worth the bother of trying to fix it.  So, I probably won't put the picture on the forum, this box has a great plan for its life, hee, hee.  Thanks anyways, Burl, have a greatest of days.  Cindi
There are strange things done in the midnight sun by the men who moil for gold.  The Arctic trails have their secret tales that would make your blood run cold.  The Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see, what the night on the marge of Lake Lebarge, I cremated Sam McGee.  Robert Service

 

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