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Author Topic: Field vs House Bees  (Read 2088 times)

Offline L Daxon

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Field vs House Bees
« on: July 11, 2013, 01:45:19 pm »
In a nearly full honey super that still needs a lot of capping completed, will most of the bees on the frames be house bees making wax to do the capping or will they be field bees bringing in more nectar and doing so capping?

ld from OKC
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Offline Better.to.Bee.than.not

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2013, 02:41:58 pm »
by field bee, I am presuming you mean a forager bee, right? the ones that go out and collect said pollen and nectar? nurse bees clean and make the cells. Bees less than 2 weeks old become involved in cleaning cells and feeding first the older larvae and then larvae of all ages. They do this as long as their glands produce food. Bees from like 8 days to 15 days produce the most wax...they excrete it and it builds up as scales on them actually...they do not spit it up or anything. The scales/chips are pure wax and then removed from their bodies usually by other bees, but sometimes by themselves and THEN chewed, manipulated and used to make comb. you'll often see these 'chips' in fact on the bottom of the hive...they look sorta like big dandruff flakes. Nurse bees meet the older bees around the entrance of the hive and take the pollen and nectar from the older forager bees and deposit it into the cells. So ya, most of the bees on the frames will be house bees. at about the third week, young bees will start taking their orientation flights at the entrance of the hive, and its sorta cool to watch. there are also propolis holding bees, who literally just hold propolis for when it is needed. they do not 'store' propolis in cells for when they need it. After 3 weeks and obviously after orientation flights, bees become foragers, just as new bees are hatched and come in to replace them as nurse bees.

P.s. This is also why many suggest feeding your bees 1:1 syrup when new, or when they are in need of cell building. and 1:2 when just trying to feed them. It takes the equivalent of roughly 8 lbs of honey to make 1 lb of wax.... thats like 3/4 a gallon of honey (a gallon of honey is typically 12 lbs. a gallon of water is typically 8 lbs.) queens furthermore do not lay steadily throughout the year. they peak, then slow for a week or two, then peak again smaller, a month or two later. That will mean of course that the younger bees between the 8-15 day 'wax creating stage' will also peak and slow of course. requeening does actually off set this peak for the time of year, but it will still have a strong peak then a weaker one. at least in my area...it may very well be different, and surely is, in different climate zones.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 03:02:38 pm by Better.to.Bee.than.not »

Online Michael Bush

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2013, 03:09:02 pm »
I'm not sure why it matters to you... but wax building is done by receiver bees who can't find a place to store the nectar.  Capping is also done by the wax workers and I suppose at the end of the season there is some work of capping that defies the typical feedback mechanisms for wax working.  Usually they are making wax because they can't empty their stomach.  At the end, I suppose there is a little bit of capping that still needs to be done when they are no longer lacking a place to put the nectar and a few wax workers would have to finish the job, perhaps by consuming some of the open nectar to make enough wax to finish it.

Detailed observations on wax working are in Huber's New Observations Upon Bees, Volume II Chapters, I through VI

http://astore.amazon.com/thepracbeek-20/detail/161476056X

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Offline L Daxon

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2013, 04:50:32 pm »
The reason I asked, and this may have been a dumb move on my part, but today I moved a honey super full of bees from a really strong hive to a weak hive whose population I was hoping to build up.  I was hoping the honey super wasn't full of field bees that would just fly out and return to their original hive. 

If the honey super had mostly house bees in it who hadn't yet oriented, then by the time they orient and start foraging they will return to the new hive and not the old one they came from.  I was just trying to equalize hive population among my hives.
linda d

Online Michael Bush

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2013, 11:56:00 am »
A newspaper combine?  Or just put the box on?  I'd be afraid of fighting... and drifting...
My website:  bushfarms.com/bees.htm en espanol: bushfarms.com/es_bees.htm  auf deutsche: bushfarms.com/de_bees.htm  em portugues:  bushfarms.com/pt_bees.htm
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Offline L Daxon

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2013, 03:34:26 pm »
Michael,
I have been moving boxes and frames between my 3 hives and a nuc all spring and summer with no apparent fighting or conflict.  It was my understanding if the foreign bees come bearing gifts, i.e. a super of honey or on a frame of brood the locals don't get too upset. Plus the hives have been smoked so maybe that masks the foreign scent.  At any rate, I haven't noticed any fighting or dead bees out front after the transfers.  Maybe I just have friendly bees.

I do, of course, use a newspaper combine when combining a caught swarm with one of my hives.

linda d

Offline Finski

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2013, 06:09:57 pm »
In a nearly full honey super that still needs a lot of capping completed, will most of the bees on the frames be house bees making wax to do the capping or will they be field bees bringing in more nectar and doing so capping?

ld from OKC

Take care that the hive has free combs where to åut nectar. If they dry up nectar in brood combs, swarming will be sure.

One capped super needs 2 more super when bees dry up the nectar.

Bees cap the honey when it is dry enough. Bees do not cap cells, which are not full. So they need continuor nectar flow.

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Offline L Daxon

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2013, 08:38:45 pm »
Thanks Finski.
I know I am having a bit of trouble staying ahead of the flow.  I've been trying to keep the brood nest open but went on vacation and got behind.  I guess I should just break down and buy some more equipment. All 3 of my hives have 2 supers on them each and I have already taken more than a super of honey off each one.  It is a good year here in Oklahoma.
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Offline Finski

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Re: Field vs House Bees
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2013, 01:22:04 am »
.
L, look too, that bees draw easily new combs for brood boxes.
It is best to do during good flow.
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