Beemaster's International Beekeeping Forum

BEEKEEPING LEARNING CENTER => RAPID BEEYARD GROWTH => Topic started by: Draginol on May 23, 2007, 09:56:24 pm

Title: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Draginol on May 23, 2007, 09:56:24 pm
I currently have two hives and am about to get a Nuc to start up a third.  I have enough space for essentially as many hives as we'd like to have but was curious to find out how many hives should a beginner stick to?  I am hoping within the next couple of years to get up to around 10 or so hives (I don't really plan to sell honey or anything, it's just a hobby for myself and my sons) but want to make sure I don't get in over my head.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks!
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Jerrymac on May 23, 2007, 09:59:37 pm
I don't think anyone here can answer that question except the person that posted it. How many are you comfortable with?
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: doak on May 23, 2007, 10:15:29 pm
I would say if you do not know a lot about bees and Bee Keeping, I would hold with 2 or 3 for at least a year or two. Read a few books, then read them again. Listen to the people on this forum. Not me inperticular, There is still a lot I don't know after 7 yrs.
But then again, like Jerrymac said, if you feel comfortable with everhow many, go for it.
doak
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Draginol on May 23, 2007, 10:19:18 pm
Thanks for the advice.

I'll probably stick this year to less than 5 this year and if all goes well rapidly expand next year based on how much time it takes. I have the bees on a vacant area of the property my business is located so I can check in on them whenever the weather conditions are ideal.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: pdmattox on May 23, 2007, 10:43:35 pm
I would at least start with two but like the others said start with what your comfortable with and look for a mentor.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: doak on May 23, 2007, 11:26:14 pm
Mentor yes. Wish,wish,wish I'd had one sooner.  :'(
doak
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: pdmattox on May 23, 2007, 11:28:22 pm
I got real lucky to get a guy with 50 years as a commercial beek just down the road from me willing to take me under his wing.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: tillie on May 24, 2007, 12:03:47 am
P.N. Williams who is a well-known beekeeper in Georgia says to start with 2 - one to thrive and another to learn from (which you probably will keep from thriving by opening all the time!

Linda T in Atlanta with 3 1/2 hives (second year bk)
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Understudy on May 24, 2007, 12:55:04 am
As others have said 2

Sincerely,
Brendhan
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Ross on May 24, 2007, 03:14:19 pm
I started with 3.  After a year I was at 6, then 10, now 30 after 6 years.  After you learn that you don't really need to be in them all the time it gets a little easier.  Then you figure out you need to move them around and it gets harder again. 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Draginol on May 25, 2007, 12:05:14 am
What made you move them around?
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Brian D. Bray on May 25, 2007, 12:30:51 am
Within a given distance there is only so much forage available for all the various types of bees and the numerous beekeepers.  It can get to the point that you have so many hives that each one has to struggle to even gather enough to overwinter.  This is oversaturation of hives.  You then need to move then so that each hive not only collects enough for its own survival but gives you a surplus as well.
I would say that 30 beehives per yard would probably be as many as you would want under normal circumstances.  Unless you have excellent forage resources.  After that It's find another yard location to keep more bees in--perferably at least 4 miles distant from you current yard so there is less forage overlap between beeyards.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Ross on May 25, 2007, 10:02:38 am
I moved my 10 strongest hives 40 miles to a farm with 120 acres of vetch in bloom.  After that it's down the road 3 miles to 100 acres of soybeans.  I am teaming with a friend that got me started in bees.  We each have about 30 hives.  We are at that stage where we can't justify a forklift and pallets, but we also have day jobs and time is precious. 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Moonshae on May 27, 2007, 08:34:16 pm
Draginol, I'm curious, you say you'd like to have about 10 hives eventually, but don't plan to sell the honey. What are you going to do with a half-ton or more of it every year? You'll make a lot of people very happy if you're just planning to give it away. :)
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Michael Bush on May 28, 2007, 01:20:12 am
Two hives is the minimum.  You can't have too many hives can you?  Well, maybe if I get over 100, I might think so.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Draginol on May 28, 2007, 01:41:05 am
Draginol, I'm curious, you say you'd like to have about 10 hives eventually, but don't plan to sell the honey. What are you going to do with a half-ton or more of it every year? You'll make a lot of people very happy if you're just planning to give it away. :)

Not sure yet what I'll end up doing. I'm more interested in the bee keeping aspect than the honey aspect of it.  ;)
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Dane Bramage on May 28, 2007, 11:58:03 am
Draginol, I'm curious, you say you'd like to have about 10 hives eventually, but don't plan to sell the honey. What are you going to do with a half-ton or more of it every year? You'll make a lot of people very happy if you're just planning to give it away. :)

Not sure yet what I'll end up doing. I'm more interested in the bee keeping aspect than the honey aspect of it.  ;)

I started with 10 hives (this year).  However, I am interested in the honey aspects... and the pollen, wax, propolis, royal jelly aspects.  Pretty much everything except apitherapy (so far, lol).
1/2 ton of honey?   :shock:  That would be awesome but I doubt I'll be harvesting 112lb/hive.  Perhaps I'll approach that next year.

I would echo the sentiments that the limiting factors are: time & money (how much can you invest) & forage area/bee yard.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Draginol on May 28, 2007, 06:04:37 pm
Because of the nature of my job, the summers tend to have more time.  My main limiting factor right now is just procuring hives since I got started late-ish.

Here's an aerial shot of where the apriary is (the little red arrow points to where my 2 hives are).

(http://www.stardock.com/brad/bees/FirstI8.jpg)
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Jerrymac on May 28, 2007, 11:30:10 pm
I don't see no arrow. I don't even see any Indians.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: JP on May 29, 2007, 09:26:21 am
Draginol, believe me, once you get a bunch of honey rolling in you will want to sell some of it simply to support your hobby. As your apiary grows you will purchase more equipment, supers, extractors, more supers, frames and frames, foundation, bottling equipment, bottles and lids, labels for your honey...
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: tennesseebeeman on July 19, 2007, 08:14:11 pm
hello i had 120 hivies  in frist year in beekeeping 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Mici on July 20, 2007, 08:09:19 am
and the second year? how many survived?
not trying to discredit you but...120 hives sounds like a bad idea to start with
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: bluegrass on July 21, 2007, 09:15:23 am
IMO the best teacher/mentor is the bees them selves. I say get as many as you feel comfortable with and can afford to loose. Don't worry about what to do with the honey.....its real easy to give it away and also other keepers who sell at farmers markets will often buy some to suppliment what they produce. With more than just a few hives you are going to have to come up with some sort of plan to extract and dispose of it though. I am starting to make mead with some of mine and I give most away. You can keep what ever # of hives you want, as long as you stay away from swarm collection and cutouts.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: topbarslo on July 21, 2007, 09:22:46 am
I am already throwing my head to the wall because I started wit only one. But this time of year it is already late...
During winter I will make som 20 new hives and populate them in the spring...:D
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Misko on July 21, 2007, 12:05:55 pm
Will all of the be TBH?
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: topbarslo on July 21, 2007, 12:38:55 pm
Will all of the be TBH?

Yes I will go with all TBH's
I think it is the best way and seeing how bees work in TBH I just cannot see myself in LG or AŽ hive ;)


Hey you live nearby and when I come back home you can come and check my tbh and vice-versa :D

Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Misko on July 21, 2007, 01:39:23 pm
Bach home where are you the? Thank's for the invatation i realy want to see a TBH  ;)
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: topbarslo on July 21, 2007, 01:48:59 pm
Bach home where are you the? Thank's for the invatation i realy want to see a TBH  ;)

I am in my home town now. I will be here for one or two weeks ... Love brought me to prlekija ;)
Sure I will contact you and we can get together when I come home :) It would be cool !
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: tennesseebeeman on July 21, 2007, 10:48:07 pm
i get 250 now or more   
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: rdy-b on July 22, 2007, 05:49:18 pm
the old bee bug - yes indedey- the old bee bug  :-D
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: mgmoore7 on August 06, 2007, 03:12:33 pm
The the bee bug has stung.

I started with 2.  Both were thriving hives.  One is busting at the seems and the other is doing well.  After having hives for a few months I can really see the benefit of having 2 as a starting point.

I just bought a 3rd on Friday as I want to have 3 or 4 in my back yard.  I can't do anymore than that from a practicality standpoint but there are many orange groves near by and I am already thinking of working a deal with them to trade the use of the location for the pollination.  Of course I get to keep the honey. 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: LocustHoney on August 06, 2007, 08:11:44 pm
I started with two and then I went outside one day and two became 10!!! I was feeling overwhelmed but now it is nothing but fun!!
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: sean on August 11, 2007, 01:09:06 am
I would say for those folks who have a mentor stick with him/her for a while until you know what you are doing then start with whatever amount you feel comfortable with. If you dont have a mentor then i'd say go with one, get comfortable with it then start your expansion.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Legion© on September 18, 2007, 06:46:03 am
Personally I would say two or three. There are definite advantages to having more than one. Being able to swap frames of young brood to a queenless hive for example. Having two also helps to show up problems that are only occuring in one hive, as the changes are only reflected in that one, and you can look to the others for confirmation of whether things are progressing normally.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: qa33010 on September 23, 2007, 11:39:26 pm
    I started just over two years ago with a feral hive and later ordered three packages of russians.  Fortunately another new beek lives real close to me so I had something to compare mine with.  The ferals are awesome as are last years russians.

    I used what I saw on the outside of the hive for a referance that first eight to nine months and it has become a habit in the morning with a cup of coffee.  Again around midday and afternoon/evening.

There is a book somewhere about watching the outside of the hive to get an idea what's going on inside.  Gotta find it for my Christmas present.  That may be an option for you...or not. 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: 12th on September 30, 2007, 01:37:35 am
This topic leads me to believe that it's not very smart to keep just one hive. Is this true?
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: buzzbee on September 30, 2007, 07:33:51 am
Keeping two hives makes it easier to see something wrong if one is doing real well and the other is doing poorly. It also helps if you can move brood from a strong hive to help a weaker one.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: 12th on September 30, 2007, 07:38:59 am
I figured as much.. Looks like I may have to hold off another year until I can afford another hive. Ah well, more time to feed my brain. =D

-Tory.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: buzzbee on September 30, 2007, 07:41:33 am
If it's all you can afford,I would do just one hive. No rule against that .Many people do fine with one!
It is still a great learning opportunity and lots of fun.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: 12th on September 30, 2007, 07:50:32 am
As long as I don't end up killing off thousands of bees.  :-P
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Michael Bush on September 30, 2007, 01:27:00 pm
>If it's all you can afford,I would do just one hive. No rule against that .Many people do fine with one!

And many people find themselves in a bind with no resources to work with for the one.  Like a suspected queenless hive and no brood to give them, or a struggling hive that won't make it through the winter and no other hive to combine them with so they won't die.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: buzzbee on September 30, 2007, 08:02:50 pm
And some people lose two for two.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Old Timer on September 30, 2007, 08:42:13 pm
>If it's all you can afford,I would do just one hive. No rule against that .Many people do fine with one!

And many people find themselves in a bind with no resources to work with for the one.  Like a suspected queenless hive and no brood to give them, or a struggling hive that won't make it through the winter and no other hive to combine them with so they won't die.


i feel that if you have to combine a hive that it did die and you have to count it as a loss. eventually the bees will die and the brood will even out to what it was before you combined them and you have one less hive. i would definitely keep more than one hive due to the many benefits.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Michael Bush on September 30, 2007, 10:50:52 pm
If I combine a hive, the bees in the hive have a shot at making it to spring.  True I'd have one less hive, but the bees are doomed.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Old Timer on October 01, 2007, 08:37:22 am
if i combine a hive, it's usually 2 weak hives that would have difficulty making it through winter. i'll pinch out the sorriest of the two queens and let the other one have it. imo, the advantages of combining are more bees now will definitely help collect stores for the winter, you don't have to worry about wax moths getting into a dead out, and you get to save that comb and the bees don't have to make it next spring. it wouldn't make much sense to combine two weak hives with two strong hives, because you lose two hives this way, but combining two weak ones, you only lose one. then in the spring you can split and have two colonies again. just a thought.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Stingray on October 21, 2007, 08:01:49 pm
I'm looking to get started in the spring with two hives. It seems that pretty much everyone agrees that two is the bare minimum. Would there be any specific advantages to having three over two? My intention is to expand to four or five hives the second year. Would it be wiser to start with three, given my intention to expand anyway?

-S
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: pdmattox on October 21, 2007, 08:04:37 pm
I say go for it. To me there is no difference except for time spent in the yard weather you have 2 or 3.  Maybe another 10 mins. I can go through a yard of 40 in about 1.5 hours or less depending on what i'm doing.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Michael Bush on October 21, 2007, 09:20:06 pm
>would there be any specific advantages to having three over two? My intention is to expand to four or five hives the second year. Would it be wiser to start with three, given my intention to expand anyway?

The advantages are you get to see more of what is normal with several hives then with two and you have more resources to draw on.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Carriage House Farm on December 20, 2007, 08:52:05 pm
Well, this is what I am going into 2008 with...my first year.

(http://gallery.mac.com/thesw0rdofroland/100046/IMG_1759/web.jpg) 



Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: pdmattox on December 20, 2007, 08:57:26 pm
nice looking set up.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: steveouk on December 30, 2007, 04:50:05 pm
I am looking to start with 2 hives but I've also been thinking about having 2 NUC boxes. My aim is to have at least 10 hives by the end of 2009 
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: marinsbee on October 31, 2010, 05:36:45 am
5 is to start just fine, maximum of 10.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: tefer2 on October 31, 2010, 12:37:22 pm
I started with four hives my first year. It was a little busy at first for me. I learned fairly quick what not to do.
It was great to have one or two frames from each for my late swarms. I made 17 gallons of honey my first year too.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: David McLeod on December 24, 2010, 08:49:40 pm
Well, I was 8 or 9 when Raymond Estis bought the Glover place two doors up the road from us. He was an older gentleman that kept bees. I was already aquainted with beekeeping as another across the creek neighbor had six hives on the back side of his pasture where I squirrel hunted and I had an aunt that kept bees. Dad and I started talking to Mr Estis about bee trees that we knew of in the woods and before I knew it I was beelining for Mr Estis and worked out a trade. He would let me watch cutouts and then as he was having some issues with lifting he let me help him in the yard. He averaged around six gums (his word for the boxes) but at one time had been a 50+ sideliner. Age had slowed him down and I was glad to be there to help. From the mundane of assembling frames and inserting foundation to lifting boxes in the yard I learned alot from Mr Estis. In the fall of my 14th year Mr Estis passed. Mrs Estis and I told the bees and one of the gums went to my place that winter. I kept hers for another couple years until Mr Estis' son took them away. Mine I split that first spring and caught a swarm so by late summer I had three but one went queenless and was combined with the swarm for two going into winter. Both were split the next spring for four with two swarms added that year for six. The next I slacked off, lost some swarms and only added two (one my only ever trap out) for eight and walked away in Dec to go in the army. They lingered for a few years after that (Dad never was interested in keeping them). I think Dad gave away a couple but they were all gone five years later when I returned.
Now 20 something years later I'm getting back in.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Acebird on January 16, 2011, 09:15:53 pm
Quote
As long as I don't end up killing off thousands of bees. 


The bottom line is they are all going to die anyway just like you.
However, I felt the same as you and started with one hive, it died and we are trying again.  This spring we will see if they make it through the winter.  I am not sure having two hives would have made any difference to us because if you don't know what is "normal" having one hive stronger than the other doesn't mean the stronger one is normal.  I also feel (my feelings) it takes time for the new bee keeper to feel comfortable being a beek.  So if all you have or want to invest in is one hive just do it rather than wait to get another hive.  By the second or third year you will know if you want to stick with it.  Then you can go hog wild.
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: Michael Bush on January 16, 2011, 11:19:01 pm
>The bottom line is they are all going to die anyway just like you.

Not necessarily.  In theory a colony could live forever as new bees and new queens are raised all the time.  Of course there is always the philosophical question, "which is the original colony"?  is it the swarm?  Is it the original location?  The original queen left with the swarm...
Title: Re: How many hives for a beginner?
Post by: T Beek on February 24, 2011, 09:49:46 am
Just discovered this thread;  You're so right Michael.  I have one colony that's been active for five winters now.  I did give them another queen three Septembers ago (before knowing they were strong enough to make their own), but can assume that they've more than likely re-queened themselves as well. 

Besides, isn't it as likely that honeybees came from 'the mother of all honeybees' (Like an Eve of the bees?) some 200 million or so years ago, and all born since having a related ancestor?  Just a thought.

Despite not having a window, this one 'strong' colony has been my "observation" hive while i learned from them (and those that didn't survive).

I started with two packages, have successfully caught several swarms, but have had issues keeping them alive for more than 1 or 2 seasons (except super hive mentioned above, that is).  Splits and NUCs for next Winter are the goal for me this season.

thomas